Date: Sun, 17 Nov 1996 20:44:38 +0000 From: BITNET list
server at BINGVMB (1.8a)
<LISTSERV@BINGVMB.cc.binghamton.edu> Subject:
File: "INDEX-L LOG9610B"
To: Julius Ariail <jariail@gsaix2.cc.GaSoU.EDU>
=================================================================
======== Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 06:40:17 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
"Cynthia D. Bertelsen" <cbertel@NRV.NET> Subject:
Publishing/Work cycles
I am just wondering if anyone can give me some ideas about what
the cycles are in terms of indexing work? I am just winding down
my first year of professional indexing and so I know that the
work flow that I have had is probably not typical. (I have done
most of my work for university presses.) Are there certain times
of the year when it is safe to contemplate taking a vacation for
sure? Or when you can be sure of plenty of steady work? I'd
also like to know about publishing cycles other than those of
university presses.
Any information would be greatly appreciated.
************
Cynthia D. Bertelsen
INDEXER
Blacksburg, VA
cbertel@nrv.net
http://www.vt.edu:10021/B/bertel/ndx.html
=================================================================
======== Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 09:18:10 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Hazel Blumberg-McKee <hazelcb@POLARIS.NET> Subject: Re:
Bifocals and ergonomics In-Reply-To:
<199610080029.UAA17187@polaris.net>
On Mon, 7 Oct 1996 Beth wrote:
> I have found that I can use a Wrist Relief Plus (by Computer
Coverup) which
> has a 3" wrist pad attached to a 9" deep shelf where the
keyboard rests.
> This allows me to pull the keyboard out slighty past the edge
of the desk
> shelf (with the wrist pad acting as an extension of the desk
shelf supporting
> my wrists) and creates room to prop up material between
keyboard and monitor.
> I bought this gadget at Office Depot for about $15 and have
been very
> pleased with it. It even leaves room for the mouse or
glidepoint (I have
> both).
The list of ergonomic solutions on this list just goes on getting
better and better. You are all such an inventive group! I can see
that I'll be heading to Office Depot soon.
> One comment about the glidepoint: I live in a very humid
climate and find
> that I can't use a touchpad when the humidity is very high.
I had been wondering why I was having so much difficulty using my
touchpad yesterday. The cursor simply was not gliding. And now
that I've read Beth's posting, I understand: With 100% humidity,
that cursor wasn't going to go *anywhere*! I think the
manufacturers should tell us about these things. Those of us who
live in the steaming swamps need to know! ;}}
> The real key
> to avoiding repetitive stress is switch from one type of
movement to another
> whenever you start to feel a strained muscle or joint. I also
have arthritis
> and have found that keeping a variety of technologies, gadgets,
chairs, etc.
> to switch around helps a lot.
I have carpal tunnel syndrome in my left hand. My doctor had
suggested noninvasive possibilities: ergonomic keyboard, lowering
the height of the keyboard, wearing a brace on my left arm when
I'm not working, and the like, before considering surgery.
Thankfully, surgery hasn't been necessary. I've been forcing
myself to mouse (or touchpad) with my right hand, so that I'm not
putting as much strain on my left (I'm left-handed). I think that
trying for some degree of ambidextrousness has helped a lot.
BTW, Josephine ended up passing us by, for which I am very
grateful. We experienced 50-mph winds, over 7 inches of rain,
flooded roads, and some power outages, but that's about it. We
also have enough hurricane supplies to last us for some time. At
least hurricane season ends in November.
Hazel
> (aka Elizabeth Tudor, The Queen of her little computer
Queendom)
This sig line is wonderful!
Hazel Blumberg-McKee (hazelcb@polaris.net)
"Hell, we're in Pensacola!"--Gov. Lawton Chiles, Florida,
who thought he was flying to Panama City
=================================================================
======== Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 09:57:41 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
"Richard T. Evans" <infodex@MINDSPRING.COM> Subject: Re:
Publishing/Work cycles
At 06:40 AM 10/8/96 -0400, you wrote:
>I am just wondering if anyone can give me some ideas about what
the cycles
>are in terms of indexing work?
I think both indexers and publishers would like to be able to
predict this.
I specialize in computer books and I certainly can't. Sometimes
it seems that publishers rush to get things done before the end
of the year and this makes for a very busy December. Other times
December is dead. Sometimes it seems like the first of the year
is hot and other times Jan and Feb are in the doldrums. I had no
less than *three* clients call in July and alert me to a heavy
load in August. *None* of it materialized. Now, it is all here
in Sep-Oct.
The only lesson I have learned is to do as much as I can when
it's available. On that basis, I have weathered two slack
periods of 4-6 weeks each this year and will still do *very* well
by year end.
Dick Evans
=================================================================
======== Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 10:18:20 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Hazel Blumberg-McKee <hazelcb@POLARIS.NET> Subject: Re:
Publishing/Work cycles In-Reply-To:
<199610081402.KAA08906@polaris.net>
I've been a full-time freelancer since 1985 (except for my
excursion into veterinary technology ;} ), and I've never figured
out what the publishing cycle is. I work for university presses
and for commercial presses. As Dick says, take the work when it's
there.
No matter what, you should *definitely* make sure that you take a
vacation. Burnout is horrible, believe me. I try to take a long
vacation (one to two weeks, which is hardly long) every year. And
weekend getaways are a big help, too. I hit ultra-stress about
every three months, so going to the beach or staying in a
bed-and-breakfast for a long weekend is an enormous help. I often
can't really afford to go away (how many times have your accounts
receivable not shown up when you thought they would?). But
psychologically, getting away from your office and your work are
absolute essentials.
I remember when I took my first long vacation. There I was,
calling my answering machine every other day to see if clients
had called, and then calling clients back. I didn't feel
particularly relaxed when I got home.
I've since learned to contact my usual clients fairly far in
advance and let them know when my long vacation will be. I also
leave some sort of message on my voicemail so that prospective
clients know I'll be getting back to them after X date. (We
normally have a wonderful college kid who housesits for us when
we're away. I don't know what we're going to do when she
graduates from college!) When you go away, *really* take a
vacation, or you'll come back as exhausted as you were when you
left.
Just my $.02.
Hazel
Hazel Blumberg-McKee (hazelcb@polaris.net)
"I am ruled by my cats."--Norman O'Toole
=================================================================
======== Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 10:34:53 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Marie-Lise Shams <mshams@CIESIN.ORG> Subject: ergonomics
<<I think the manufacturers should tell us about these things.
Those of us who live in the steaming swamps need to know!.....>>
The manufacturers probably don't even know it, especially if the
company is in a somewhat dryer climate.
I am learning a great deal from all your wonderful tips. Thanks
Marie-Lise
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
^ Marie-Lise Shams ^
^ Information Specialist ^
^ Consortium for International Earth ^
^ Science Information Network (CIESIN) ^
^ 2250 Pierce Road ^
^ University Center Michigan 48710 ^
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
^ Phone: +1-517-797-2790 ^
^ Fax: +1-517-797-2622 ^
^ E-mail: mshams@ciesin.org ^
^ URL: http://www.ciesin.org ^
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
=================================================================
======== Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 10:56:29 -0400 Reply-To:
jason.warren@ibm.net
Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET>
From: Jason Warren <shirleywa@IBM.NET> Subject:
wannabe seeeking advice
NOTE: This is a long letter.
I am a neophyte indexer-wannabe seeking advice. I have been - uh
- lurking (what an awful word...sounds like something a teenage
hacker must have invented) on index-l for a month or so,
listening to all the experts and being simultaneously educated
and intimidated. About two months ago my husband read me a
letter to the editor in Internet Magazine from Peg Mauer, wherein
we both learned that there were actually people who were
professional indexers. ( A note of explanation here: I have
complained all of my adult life about lousy indexes and
inadequate cross-referencing.) Up to that point I thought, like
'most everyone else in the world who has thought about it at all,
that an index was something that just sort of automatically
happened at the publishing house when a book got written.
Obviously now that there are computers, they must be doing it ALL
nowadays. Peg's letter set me straight; and after I wrote her
e-mail and she replied most graciously and generously I began my
first steps toward learning this potentially fascinating craft.
I signed up for the USDA course, which now sits on my desk, and I
attended the Massachusetts ASI Conference a few weeks ago. I
plan to take a one-day workshop soon. That's my background as
far as getting into this. What I am seeking is an interesting
career, probably part-time, which I can learn without going to
graduate school, and which I can practice at home while leading
the remarkably full life I already enjoy as a mother, musician
and community volunteer. My questions to anyone who wants to
answer me ( either to my e-mail address or to the list; I'm not
sure how interesting this topic would be to the listees in
general) are as follows.
1) How can I best learn indexing? Do I need to take graduate
courses in information science or computer programming, or should
I just buy second-hand nonfiction books and mark up the pages?
People talk so much about Macrex and Cindex. Can I learn
indexing just as well - and inexpensively- on index cards, or is
that like digging up dinosaurs with a teaspoon to learn
paleontology?
2) Is it possible to be marketable without an area of expertise?
I am an intelligent generalist who has never had a "real" career.
Kept waiting for something to come along and all of a sudden I am
almost fifty....
3) Can you really do this part-time? My understanding is that
if you work on scholarly books for an academic press that pays a
dollar a page you might have some time-luxury but that anything
other than that requires you to commit eighty hours a week to
impossible deadline schedules after which you might not see
another job for months. Is this a wrong impression?
Sorry to go on at such length, but I am considering putting in a
lot of time on this, and I am trying to find out if it is really
for me.
Shirley Warren, shirleywa@aol.com
=================================================================
======== Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 05:45:16 -0500 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Reina Pennington <RPennington@INFOAVE.NET> Subject: Re:
ergonomics
In-Reply-To: <01IADRIEE2OI8XIXU8@InfoAve.Net>
Hi, folks. I'm a graduate student, freelance writer, and
volunteer indexer, and spend hours and hours in front of the
computer every day. I can't stress enough how much utility and
ergonomic relief there is in adjusting your setup so that the
materials you work with are directly in front of you (below the
monitor). The simplest thing is to buy one of those rolling
computer desks -- mine has a monitor shelf which allows you to
put the monitor at eye level, with a big slantboard below (about
11 1/2 " by 26"), and a pull-out keyboard shelf the same width.
There's about a 1/4 inch lip on the slant shelf, but you can slip
a slat into it to help hold thicker documents. I have a
fluorescent lamp angled in so it shines on the documents without
much glare on the monitor. The slant shelf is a little short for
legal-height docs, unfortunately, but easily holds a
three-page-wide spread of papers.
I don't have an ergonomic keyboard, but I DO have a wonderful
thing called a "Switchboard" from Datadesk. This is a modular
keyboard that allows you to swap the modules to whatever spot you
prefer. I have the numeric pad on the left (since I rarely use
it), the QWERTY-spread in the *center* (so my hands are nearly
always dead center), and I have a trackball module in the right
slot. Thus, I don't have to use a mouse, all my hand motions are
minimized, and there's even room left for my coffee beside the
keyboard.
I also have a comfortable padded office chair with padded arms
and a lumbar cushion, and a footrest to keep my knees at the
prescribed 90 degree angle.
Last but not least, a space heater keeps my toes toasty when it's
drafty.
This whole setup is placed perpendicular to my actual desk, and
the printer is on a small table on the other side of the cart.
The two most critical elements are the slantboard directly in
line with the monitor, and the keyboard with an integrated
trackball (touchpad, etc.).
These carts are only about $70 (some assembly required) and WELL
worth the investment!
Reina Pennington <RPennington@InfoAve.net> Dept. of History,
University of South Carolina
=================================================================
======== Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 11:02:27 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Susan Healy <welshone@FREENET.SCRI.FSU.EDU> Subject: Re:
database indexing (was:future librarians/indexers) In-Reply-To:
<199609132225.SAA29058@fn4.freenet.tlh.fl.us>
Sorry to reply to this thread so long after it was woven. Here
in Florida's legislature our indexing section has just completed
work on our index to 1996 Florida Statutes Supplement. I imagine
we could be classified as database indexers. Our statutes are
continuously revised and cumulatively republished in odd-numbered
years. During even-numbered years we the revised statutes
affected by that year's legislative session. Preparation of the
statutes index is a 5 month project with the remainder of the
year taken up with indexes of other legislative publications.
Are there other legislative or legal indexers out there (other
than Maryann, of course)?
Susan Healy
Florida Legislature
Division of Statutory Revision
=================================================================
======== Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 12:24:55 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Susan Holbert <susanh@WORLD.STD.COM> Subject: Re: Work
cycles/vacations
The one work cycle I know of is in publishing textbooks. Many
textbooks are scheduled for the publishers' fall list. Indexing
takes place over the summer. This is a good time to call
textbooks publishers for new work.
I take a month's "retreat" to Cape Cod from mid-December to
mid-January. If someone offers me an index at that time I turn it
down. I don't think there is any other way to plan a vacation.
Even that does not always work, as clients who promised that the
job would be over in October or November are, on occasion, still
sending pages at Christmas. I have a portable computer and tiny
printer that I bought second hand. (Even a retreat would not be
possible for me without a computer.) When I need to finish a job,
I take the job with me, making sure the client understands and
hopefully appreciates the extra effort.
It is important to realize that fees for projects do not just
cover the time spent working on the project. If you want to make
$40,000/yr, you must be grossing $40/hr. That is the only way to
pay for vacations, sick time, and slack time, which are
legitimate and unavoidable freelance expenses.
To have work when you come back from your vacation, schedule your
marketing letters and phone calls a few months in advance. I have
found 2-3 months to be the time lag between marketing efforts and
returns.
Susan Holbert
INDEXING SERVICES
24 Harris Steet
Waltham, MA 02154-6105
617-893-0514
susanh@world.std.com
"Training workshops and videos"
=================================================================
======== Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 15:31:12 -0500 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Rob Gould <rgould@BVS.COM> Subject: Student Assistant
Training
STUDENT ASSISTANT TRAINING
This is a quick note to update information that has been floating
around on library listserv's. In 1991, I created LC Easy, a
computer-based training program for library student assistants,
on the Library of Congress Classification System. The program
was recently upgraded from DOS only to a Windows and
Macintosh version 2.0. However, old information persists on the
internet.
Not wishing to pollute your listserve discussions with blatent
advertising, I would like only to suggest you visit my website
for further information. It displays some of the lesson screens,
drills, and all pertinent ordering information. I've made some
additions to the original program which have thus far been very
well received. Thank you.
LC Easy homepage: www.lightlink.com/kish
=================================================================
======== Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 13:13:41 -0700 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Sonsie <sconroy@SLONET.ORG> Subject: Re: Handling Page
Proofs
At 08:57 PM 10/6/96 -0400, ROBJRICH@AOL.COM wrote:
Bob, that's a great idea, especially for books that you think you
might want to keep and don't expect to receive from the publisher
in a bound volume.
My only concern is that I do have office-paper recycling in my
neighborhood (I probably contribute 90% of the paper on
collection days), and I'd have to unbind the books to recycle the
pages. But I found your idea so intriguing that I think I may try
it with the next book I do.
=Sonsie=
=================================================================
======== Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 16:48:20 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Laura Brown <Shelby100@AOL.COM> Subject: request for removal
Please remove me from this list. Shelby100@aol.com
=================================================================
======== Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 21:53:00 BST-1 Reply-To:
jsampson@cix.compulink.co.uk Sender: Indexer's Discussion
Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From: John Sampson
<jsampson@CIX.COMPULINK.CO.UK> Subject: Re: Dvorak to QWERTY
Keyboarding
Trying to get info on this as suggested I got the following error
message. Perhaps I should not have put DVORAK in the body as well
as in the subject but my mailer won't allow nothing in the body
of an e-mail. I am not expert in e-mail so I cannot make much
sense of this message.
--------------------------------------
Memo #15730 (2686)
>From Tue Oct 8 10:22:46 1996
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Delivery Subsystem <MAILER-DAEMON@clark.net> Subject: Returned
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The original message was received at Tue, 8 Oct 1996 05:22:19
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----- The following addresses have delivery notifications
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----- Transcript of session follows ----- 554 MX list for
freecom.com. points back to mail.Clark.Net 554
<TRUEINFO@FREECOM.COM>... Local configuration error
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Date: Tue, 8 Oct 96 10:20 BST-1
From: jsampson@cix.compulink.co.uk (John Sampson) Subject: DVORAK
To: TRUEINFO@FREECOM.COM
Reply-To: jsampson@cix.compulink.co.uk
Message-Id: <memo.469439@cix.compulink.co.uk>
DVORAK
--FAA18256.844766539/mail.Clark.Net--
=================================================================
======== Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 18:11:26 -0500 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Guy Allan Twombly <gat0002@JOVE.ACS.UNT.EDU> Subject:
Question
Hello
I am a Graduate student in Library and Information Science at
the University of North Texas. One of my asignments is to write
a career report. The topic that I choose is indexer. I looking
for salary information for both freelance and nonfreelance
indexers. Any information on reference materials covering the
career indexer would be appreciated.
You can send your replys to me personally. Thank you.
Guy Twombly
gat0002@jove.acs.unt.edu
=================================================================
======== Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 20:31:59 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Janet Russell <CorofinInd@AOL.COM> Subject: Re: Ergonomics,
ideas about
>
>On Mon, 7 Oct 1996, Hilary Calvert wrote:
>
>> Errhem! We're not *all* ASI members! Some of us wade in the
primordial
>> slime on the other side of the pond ...
>>
>> However, I'm sure we wouldn't mind being included!
And Hazel replied..
><<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<blush>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>
>I can only say, by way of apology, that (1) I have not drunk
sufficient
>amounts of caffeine yet this morning, and that (2) a tropical
storm may be
>bearing down upon us. (Now, don't you all feel sorry for me?
It's pouring
>in absolute, nearly horizontal waves.)
>
>Now, if we were to write such a pamphlet, perhaps we could find
some
>indexing organizations that might be interested in publishing
same.
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^
The last time I saw Nancy Mulvaney she was begging for articles
on indexing for the _INDEXER_, of which she is now editor.
Since we are discovering that aching eyes, backs, hands, etc. are
universal, except for those of us who are underemployed, the
_INDEXER_ would be an appropriate venue for the article we have
just decided Hazel is going to write.
Janet Russell
Corofin Indexing Services
=================================================================
======== Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 20:05:49 -0500 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Guy Allan Twombly <gat0002@JOVE.ACS.UNT.EDU> Subject:
Question (fwd)
sorry I sent the original message to the wrong address.
x
---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996
18:11:26 -0500 (CDT) From: Guy Allan Twombly
<gat0002@jove.acs.unt.edu> To: INDEX-L@BINGVMB.CC.BINGHAMTON.EDU
Subject: Question
Hello
I am a Graduate student in Library and Information Science at
the University of North Texas. One of my asignments is to write
a career report. The topic that I choose is indexer. I looking
for salary information for both freelance and nonfreelance
indexers. Any information on reference materials covering the
career indexer would be appreciated.
You can send your replys to me personally. Thank you.
Guy Twombly
gat0002@jove.acs.unt.edu
=================================================================
======== Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 21:14:06 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Locatelli@AOL.COM
Subject: Re: wannabe seeking advice
Shirley asked about getting started with indexing.
I took the indexing class (10-weeks long) from the University of
Chicago Publishing Program. Many people on the list have done/are
doing the USDA course. After that, it was just a matter of
plunging in, doing a real index.
(If you have time for practice indexes, that's fine too. And
practice what ever way is best for you. Using second-hand books
is a good idea.)
It doesn't matter what you use for the mechanics of indexing,
it's the intellectual process that you need to practice. And by
all means, ask questions of folks here, and by ALL means, explore
the American Society of Indexers Web site, which has all sorts of
information about indexing: http://www.well.com/user/asi/. Then
attend workshops, the ASI conference, read Nancy Mulvany's and
Hans Wellisch's indexing books for good basic information.
My first two indexes I did marking the text and entering into
WordPerfect, doing all the alphabetizing and formatting myself.
After realizing I was going to keep doing indexing on a regular
basis, I investigated several programs (getting advice from a
number of people here on the list) and ended up with CINDEX. So
you can start with file cards too.
As for marketability, market your general expertise. So far I've
indexed books on French history, eating disorders, history of
black music, gays in the military, art education, mysticism, and
a biography of Virginia Woolf.
And that's with a B.S. in mathematics and a 25-year career in
arts management.
I've been indexing part-time for close to two years now and it's
definitely possible. Of course, I'm only working on one project
at a time. I work evenings and weekends and have not missed a
deadline yet (and don't plan too). I've also turned down several
jobs because I knew I couldn't fit them into my limited schedule.
Finally, get that dollar-a-page figure out of your head! If
anyone offers you that, run the other way. Most folks here, I
would say, don't work for less than $3.00 per page, except for
special circumstances. Any less than that just doesn't make it
worth while, nor is it proper recompense for the intellectual
effort required to produce a good index.
Good luck, Shirley, and keep asking those questions.
Fred Leise
"Between the Lines" Indexing and Editorial Services
=================================================================
======== Date: Tue, 8 Oct 1996 23:34:51 EDT Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Chuck Brockman <75176.605@COMPUSERVE.COM> Subject: Dvorak
Paper - Bad Address Explained
<<Anyone interested in learning more about the Dvorak layout may
receive a four-page synopsis entitled "Overview Information About
the Dvorak Keyboard." It was written by Randy Cassingham who also
wrote a book on the subject. Send an email to
TRUEINFO@FREECOM.COM with the subject DVORAK. The autoreply
program will ship the document back to you.>>
To Michael Brackney, John Sampson and others who tried to
retrieve this document:
I notified the author (Randy Cassingham) that the autoresponder
was not working. He checked it and found that it, indeed, was
dead. He notified his service provider today. I tried it again
within the last hour. It is still down.
Until it is fixed, the document is available at Mr. Cassingham's
Web site. It is addressed as: WWW.FREECOM.COM
Those without direct Internet access can wait for the
autoresponder to reappear or email the Web site through an Agora
server. (Gosh, I love that kind of talk.)
Here's how:
Address: agora@info.lanic.utexas.edu
Subject: [blank or anything, it doesn't matter] Body: send
http://www2.freecom.com/true/dvorak.html
Hope that helps, Chuck Brockman
=================================================================
======== Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 05:03:20 -0600 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Michael & Cheryl Dietsch <skyler@IQUEST.NET> Subject: Re:
Publishing/Work cycles
Cynthia D. Bertelsen wrote:
>
> I am just wondering if anyone can give me some ideas about what
the cycles
> are in terms of indexing work? I am just winding down my first
year of
> professional indexing and so I know that the work flow that I
have had is
> probably not typical. (I have done most of my work for
university presses.)
> Are there certain times of the year when it is safe to
contemplate taking a
> vacation for sure? Or when you can be sure of plenty of steady
work? I'd
> also like to know about publishing cycles other than those of
university
> presses.
>
> Any information would be greatly appreciated.
>
> ************
>
> Cynthia D. Bertelsen
> INDEXER
> Blacksburg, VA
> cbertel@nrv.net
> http://www.vt.edu:10021/B/bertel/ndx.html
Cynthia,
I work as an in-house indexer for a computer publishing company,
and our heaviest time is in late summer through early December so
that we can get our books on the shelves for the Christmas rush.
We have another, somewhat smaller, crunch time in the spring,
partially due to books that are targeted at colleges and
universities and need to be in the professors' hands for review
by the end of the spring semester. The workload is probably the
lightest just after Christmas for a couple of months or so.
Cheryl Dietsch
skyler@iquest.net
=================================================================
======== Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 13:26:00 BST-1 Reply-To:
hcalvert@cix.compulink.co.uk Sender: Indexer's Discussion
Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From: Hilary Calvert
<hcalvert@CIX.COMPULINK.CO.UK> Subject: Re: Ergonomics,
ideas about
>The last time I saw Nancy Mulvaney she was begging for articles
on
>indexing for the _INDEXER_, of which she is now editor.
In fact Janet Shuter is the editor of the Indexer, and Nancy is
the Associate Editor. I was talking to Janet yesterday and
happened to mention the Index-L correspondence and she suggested
having something for the Indexer on this subject - without being
prompted! She considers, however, that it would be more
appropriate as a short feature rather than a fully-referenced
article. So, Hazel, are you ready?
Drusilla
=================================================================
======== Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 09:35:14 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
TAHUDOBA@AOL.COM
Subject: Re: database indexing (was:future
librarians/indexers)
In a message dated 96-10-08 11:09:55 EDT, you write:
<<
Sorry to reply to this thread so long after it was woven. Here
in Florida's legislature our indexing section has just completed
work on our index to 1996 Florida Statutes Supplement. I
imagine we could be classified as database indexers. Our
statutes are continuously revised and cumulatively republished
in odd-numbered years. During even-numbered years we the
revised statutes affected by that year's legislative session.
Preparation of the statutes index is a 5 month project with the
remainder of the year taken up with indexes of other legislative
publications.
Are there other legislative or legal indexers out there (other
than Maryann, of course)?
Susan Healy
Florida Legislature
Division of Statutory Revision
>>
Hi Susan--
I too am a legislative indexer in Minnesota (Maryann is one of my
colleagues and the final arbitrator of many language and style
issues for the statutes index). We have a similar schedule of
revising and updating the statutes index after each legislative
session, but our publication dates are in even-numbered years. We
will soon be converting our indexing work to a new database
program that is being customed-tailored for this project. More on
this later when we actually start using the program.
Terri Hudoba
Indexers Plus
Edina MN
tahudoba@aol.com
=================================================================
======== Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 09:40:26 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Charlotte Skuster <cskuster@LIBRARY.LIB.BINGHAMTON.EDU> Subject:
Indexing opportunity--Indexer for United Nations pub (fwd)
This was forwarded from the ASI admin office. Please reply to
frankard-little@un.org --not to the list. Charlotte
>From: frankard-little@un.org
>Date: Tue, 08 Oct 96 14:45:17 EST
>To: asi@well.com, dieyeb@un.org
>Subject: Index
>
>
> Dear Madam/Sir
>
> We are finalizing a book for publication on "Development
Strategy
> and Management of the Market Economy" containing chapters
by eminent
> economists be published by Oxford University Press in the
United
> Kingdom. The book format is 6x9 and has 650 pages.
>
> We would need a single combined index with names and
subjects.
> The deadline is short, approximately two weeks from time of
delivery.
>
> Would you have names of professional indexers in the New
York City
> area?
>
> Also, could you give us the ongoing rates for this kind
of work.
>
> Our address is: United Nations, DESIPA, c/o Beatrice
Little,
> DC2-2332, New York, NY 10017. Tel. (212) 963 1798 Fax
(212) 963 4324
> and my email address: frankard-little@un.org.
>
> Thank you in advance for your help.
>
> Yours sincerely,
> B. Little
>
>
>
>
>
=================================================================
======== Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 10:17:55 -0500 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
"Jean A. Thompson" <THOMPSON@CNSVAX.ALBANY.EDU> Subject: Re:
Ergonomics
A lot of my work as a Cataloger also involves long hours at the
computer.
When I worked for a health insurance company they required us to
learn and do (on a regular, hourly or every other hour basis)
ergonomic exercises.
As a result their workers' comp claims plummeted. They made sure
we would continue doing them by making it a part of our
performance evaluations. I can pass on a description of some of
these exercises if Index-Lers are interested. (Contact me
individually or post to the list which I read somewhat delayed in
digest form.)
BTW, the exercises I have mentioned above are meant to *prevent*
injury by getting the blood flowing through and nourishing the
muscles properly. I don't think they will help after one is
injured except to prevent further injury.
At any rate, I am now a Cataloger (Librarian) again and do most
of my work at the computer. Even though I knew better, my work
environment is fraught with interruptions and distractions and no
one else here was doing ergonomic exercises, so eventually I
began developing carpal tunnel syndrome, especially in my right
hand that I also write with. (Early symptom is numbness in the
thumb and first two fingers, typically at night when sleeping,
not when working!)
My doctor prescribed hand splints to wear only when sleeping and
I prescribed elastic, fingerless gloves when working as some of
my co-workers had taken to wearing. They do feel great. The
kind I have are called Thera-Glove and they come in three weights
(light, medium, heavy) and four sizes (XS, S, M, L). Even though
I consider my hand small, I use a Medium size with the heavy
(strongest) elastic. I got them at my pharmacy prescription
counter for $12.99 a pair. They are washable. Once again, I
think they do more to prevent injury than to heal an injury
already sustained. (I, too, have no financial interest in this
company.) If you are unable to locate them where you live,
contact me privately and I'll give you the address and phone
number in Cornwall, NY.
I've suggested to my library colleagues that we all wear our
elastic gloves and/or wrist splints to the annual Longevity
Awards Luncheon in the spring and raise our hands high when we
applaud ;-)
Jean Thompson
thompson@cnsvax.albany.edu
=================================================================
======== Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 08:08:01 -0700 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Pam Rider <prider@POWERGRID.ELECTRICITI.COM> Subject: Re:
Ergonomics, ideas about
>The last time I saw Nancy Mulvaney she was begging for articles
on indexing
> for the _INDEXER_, of which she is now editor. Since we are
discovering
>that aching eyes, backs, hands, etc. are universal, except for
those of us
>who are underemployed, the _INDEXER_ would be an appropriate
venue for the
>article we have just decided Hazel is going to write.
>
Fine. As far as it goes. I suspect many _INDEXER_ readers also
have fine input on ergonomics. I think it would be worth a try
for someone to see if the newsletter would agree to a regular
column that would include q and a's about ergonomics, plus tips.
I envision that one issue's column would have a number of
unanswered questions from readers, answers to previous questions,
and those floating tips.
I hardly think the problems or solutions lend themselves to a
one-shot treatment.
Pam Rider
Trying to walk cheerfully on the Earth
prider@powergrid.electriciti.com
prider@tsktsk.com
http://www.electriciti.com:80/~prider/
=================================================================
======== Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 09:39:13 -0700 Reply-To:
"Carolyn G. Weaver" <cweaver@u.washington.edu> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
"Carolyn G. Weaver" <cweaver@U.WASHINGTON.EDU> Subject:
Program update, PNW/ASI "Indexing Software Showcase"
A late (and exciting!) addition to the five indexing software
demonstrations that were previously announced for the Pacific
Northwest Chapter/ASI's "Indexing Software Showcase" in Portland:
Frank Stearns will be demonstrating the newly released Windows
version of IXGen, a dedicated indexing tool for FrameMaker that
supports imbedded indexing.
Note also that the meeting is now ending at 4 pm to provide time
for the additional session. See you all in November!
Carolyn Weaver
Program Chair, PNW/ASI
---------- Forwarded message ----------
PACIFIC NORTHWEST CHAPTER
AMERICAN SOCIETY OF INDEXERS
Presents
"An Indexing Software Showcase"
Saturday, November 2, 1996
Noon - 4 pm
Portland State University, Fourth Avenue Bldg.
1900 SW Fourth, Portland, Oregon
Still trying to decide on the best indexing software for your
purposes?
Considering a move to a different product? Looking for user tips?
This is your opportunity to see live demonstrations and compare
the features of CINDEX and MACREX, the DOS programs most widely
used by professional indexers in the U.S. and Canada, as well as
to see other indexing programs that are currently available for
Macintosh and Windows platforms.
Louise Martin, an experienced CINDEX user, and Do Mi Stauber, a
long-time MACREX advocate, will demonstrate the strengths and
special features of these popular programs. There will also be
opportunity for current users of these programs to ask questions
and share ideas.
The newly released CINDEX for the Macintosh, HyperIndex (for
Macintosh), and Sky Index for Windows will all be demonstrated by
Carolyn Weaver.
Computer-assisted indexing has long been confined to DOS
platforms. These three programs offer alternatives for Macintosh
and Windows users.
Location:
The building we're meeting in is an office building close to the
heart of downtown Portland at 1900 SW Fourth; it's a recent
Portland State University acquisition near the PSU campus. The
entrance, which is near the intersection of SW Hall, has large
"1900" numerals above the door. Parking is available nearby in an
unmarked PSU lot to the north at Fourth and Harrison, just past
the Jasmine Tree restaurant on the left side of SW Fourth; this
lot is not patrolled on Saturdays. There are also street parking
meters and pay parking lots in the area.
Directions:
(1) From north of Portland: From I-5, take I-405 south across the
Fremont Bridge, then take the 6th Avenue exit. Follow SW Sixth
Avenue to SW Hall and turn right onto Hall for two blocks; Hall
ends right in front of the building at 1900 SW Fourth. (2) From
south of Portland: From I-5, take I-405 northbound, then take the
4th Avenue exit and follow SW Fourth to the 1900 block. (3) From
east or west of Portland: Follow highway signs to downtown
Portland. (4) From downtown Portland: Head south on SW Fifth
Avenue to SW Hall and turn left onto Hall for one block.
Registration (includes box lunch): $10 for ASI members; $14 for
nonmembers.
Prepayment required. Deadline: Tuesday, Oct. 29, 1996.
Sandwich choices: Turkey or Vegetarian. Please specify below.
Questions: Julie Kawabata (jkawa@teleport.com or 503-231-8029) or
program chair Carolyn Weaver (cweaver@u.washington.edu or
206-543-3401)
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
- - - - - - - RSVP: Send check payable to PNW Chapter, ASI, to:
Julie Kawabata, Secretary/Treasurer, PNW/ASI 927 SE Clatsop St.,
Portland, OR 97202
Deadline: Tuesday, October 29, 1996
Your Name____________________________________
Number Attending_____
ASI member_____ Nonmember_____
Amount Enclosed____________
Sandwich choice: Turkey_____ Vegetarian_____
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
- - - - - - -
=================================================================
======== Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 16:21:39 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
TAHUDOBA@AOL.COM
Subject: Re: Ergonomics, ideas about
In a message dated 96-10-09 13:49:14 EDT, you write:
<snip>
>The last time I saw Nancy Mulvaney she was begging for articles
on indexing > for the _INDEXER_, of which she is now editor.
Since we are discovering >that aching eyes, backs, hands, etc.
are universal, except for those of us >who are underemployed,
the _INDEXER_ would be an appropriate venue for the >article we
have just decided Hazel is going to write.
>
Fine. As far as it goes. I suspect many _INDEXER_ readers also
have fine input on ergonomics. I think it would be worth a try
for someone to see if the newsletter would agree to a regular
column that would include q and a's about ergonomics, plus tips.
I envision that one issue's column would have a number of
unanswered questions from readers, answers to previous questions,
and those floating tips.
I hardly think the problems or solutions lend themselves to a
one-shot treatment.
Pam Rider
<snip>
Great idea Pam--how about a similar column in _Keywords_?
Terri Hudoba
Indexers Plus
Edina, MN
tahudoba@aol.com
=================================================================
======== Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 14:42:11 -0700 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Victoria Baker <vbaker@WAONLINE.COM> Subject: Subentry
order, scholarly (help?)
I'm starting a run-in index for a well-known large university
press, contracted by the author, who has forwarded the press's
author guidelines for indexes. These guidelines contain the
following paragraph:
"In general, arrange the subentries according to the *page
numbers* that follow each; the first number in each list
determines the position of the subentry. This amounts to a
sequential arrangement. Occasionally--but not often--there is
reason for alphabetical arrangement of subentries (as in the case
of a series of book titles)."
This is the first time I have run into this request. Would
indexers who do scholarly indexing please comment--have you seen
this, what do you do? I've done a fair number of scholarly
works, but I've only been indexing a few years. Consulting
Mulvany (pp.123-126), I find that I share her concerns (no
surprise--she was my teacher). The book is not biography or
history.
This is a current project for a press I've not worked with
before--perhaps we could correspond privately? I'll be happy to
do a later summary for the list.
Thank you.
Best--Victoria
=================================================================
======== Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 18:14:11 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Infojo6363@AOL.COM
Subject: Prospective Apprentice seeks work
Dear Index-lr's,
I have taken courses in Indexing, Abstracting and Thesaurus
construction. In addition, I have a background in graphic arts
and knowledge of the following: survey research, research
methods, sociology, political science, race relations, ethnic
studies, urban history, urban planning, anthropology, human
geography/demography, library and information science, internet,
pop culture, pop psyche, spirituality/pop theology, ecology. My
interests are very eclectic and I'm a quick study.
I am the librarian (half-time) for a small art museum. I will be
available for sub-contracting work beginning January 1997. If
anyone is anticipating the need for extra assistance beginning in
that time period or after - please keep me in mind.
thanks in advance
j.p.
=================================================================
======== Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 11:56:13 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Craig Brown <104571.560@COMPUSERVE.COM> Subject: Re: wannabe
seeking advice
Shirley Warren writes (in part):
>>How can I best learn indexing? Do I need to take graduate
courses in information science or computer programming, or should
I just buy second-hand nonfiction books and mark up the pages?<<
I recommend a course, whether the USDA course or the University
of Chicago course Fred Leise mentions, or another. You will
learn subtleties you may miss studying indexes on your own.
Consider alphabetization. My current text uses a scheme that is
not obvious at first glance. For example:
McDonald, Alt, 00
macrame, 00
St. Augustine grass, 00
Salade Nicoise, 00
If those entries are buried in a huge list, it isn't all that
obvious to the casual reader that "McDonald" and "St." are
entered as if spelled out.
A good course will point out this alternative alphabetization
scheme.
Can you learn it without a course? Sure. But I believe that
coursework will put you on the road to becoming an indexer much
more quickly than self-study.
Good luck and keep us posted on your progress.
Cheers,
Craig Brown
The Last Word
=================================================================
======== Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 17:05:26 -0700 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Pam Rider <prider@POWERGRID.ELECTRICITI.COM> Subject: Re:
Ergonomics, ideas about
>Great idea Pam--how about a similar column in _Keywords_?
>
>
>Terri Hudoba
>Indexers Plus
>Edina, MN
>tahudoba@aol.com
>
Given _Keywords_ agreement, sure!
Pam Rider
Trying to walk cheerfully on the Earth
prider@powergrid.electriciti.com
prider@tsktsk.com
http://www.electriciti.com:80/~prider/
=================================================================
======== Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 21:35:42 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Locatelli@AOL.COM
Subject: Re: Subentry order, scholarly (help?)
All the books I've done so fare for Oxford Univ. Pr., Columbia
Univ. Pr. and Univ. of Chicago Pr. have all used subentries in
alpha order. It seems to me that alpha order makes it much easier
for the reader to scan for entries. I Date: Sun, 17 Nov
1996 20:44:38 +0000 From: BITNET list server at BINGVMB (1.8a)
<LISTSERV@BINGVMB.cc.binghamton.edu> Subject:
File: "INDEX-L LOG9610B"
To: Julius Ariail <jariail@gsaix2.cc.GaSoU.EDU>
can't imagine that being referred to as "occasionally" better.
The only time I've used page order so far was in a biography and
then, only for those heading where chronological/page order
seemed more appropriate.
Seems to me they've got it reversed.
Fred Leise
"Between the Lines" Indexing and Editorial Services
=================================================================
======== Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 19:46:12 -0700 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Victoria Baker <vbaker@WAONLINE.COM> Subject: Re: Subentry
order, scholarly (help?)
Fred wrote:
>All the books I've done so fare for Oxford Univ. Pr., Columbia
Univ. Pr. and
>Univ. of Chicago Pr. have all used subentries in alpha order. It
seems to me
>that alpha order makes it much easier for the reader to scan for
entries. I
>can't imagine that being referred to as "occasionally" better.
>
>The only time I've used page order so far was in a biography and
then, only
>for those heading where chronological/page order seemed more
appropriate.
>
>Seems to me they've got it reversed.
Thanks for writing. Well, yes, I thought so too, but wondered if
there is some experience out there that would say differently.
Also, I don't know if I really could do it (and this is the part
I'd thought I'd wanted to stay private about), so I was wondering
what to do about NOT following the guideline. However, I have
now talked with the author, who also thinks it is not a good
idea, but will check with his editor at Harvard to see if there
is some reason for it. Also, his last book with them was done
with alpha-sorted subentries, so all is well.
I guess I was feeling intimidated--how could I challenge Harvard?
It seems obvious now--you open your mouth and ask questions.
Best--Victoria
=================================================================
======== Date: Wed, 9 Oct 1996 23:47:48 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
JPerlman@AOL.COM
Subject: Re: Subentry order, scholarly (help?)
Victoria,
Now that you've mentioned the publisher as Harvard Univ. Press, I
can tell you that I did an index for one of their books, under
contract to the author, and I didn't get any such guidelines
about numerical order, nor did I do that. They do use a run-in
style, rather than an indented style, but subentries were
alphabetized as we are used to seeing them.
How odd that you got those guidelines. Perhaps you could do some
research in a good library and see some other indexes in Harvard
University Press books.
That is, assuming you had a library or bookshop that had enough
of their books to do so. You would see their style that way.
Let us know what happens. You seem to have run into an odd
situation here!
Janet
=================================================================
======== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 08:12:10 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Hazel Blumberg-McKee <hazelcb@POLARIS.NET> Subject: Re:
Subentry order, scholarly (help?) In-Reply-To:
<199610092343.TAA25533@polaris.net>
Eeeeek! I do not envy you having to index in page number order. I
have not had to do this for a press, and I've been a freelancer
since 1985. I *have*, however, seen such indexes. They've usually
been in biographies that were published in Great Britain.
Frankly, page number order for subheads drives me crazy. And I'll
bet that it drives other readers crazy, as well. You can fairly
easily get your indexing software, whatever it may be, to sort
subheads into that order.
But I don't think page number order helps your readers at all,
*especially* if the work isn't biographical.
Is there any possibility of talking with the people at the press
and expressing your concerns? A reader will have to thoroughly
*know* the subject and the order in which the author discusses
the subject to use the index. That's expecting far, far too much
of someone.
Perhaps the author and the press haven't thought this one
through. I'd try, if I were you, to do a bit of tactful
"educating." If they still want the index in that order, fine. No
one will be able to find anything, but the author and press will
get what they want.
Just my $.02. I'm eager to hear what others have to say on this
one.
Good luck!
Hazel
Hazel Blumberg-McKee (hazelcb@polaris.net)
"I am ruled by my cats."--Norman O'Toole
=================================================================
======== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 08:49:02 -0400 Reply-To:
ghackett@bio.umass.edu
Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET>
Comments: Warning -- original Sender: tag was
ghackett@MARLIN.BIO.UMASS.EDU From: Grant Hackett
<ghackett@BIO.UMASS.EDU> Subject: USDA
Quickly--where can I access info. re the USDA course?
ghackett@bio.umass.edu
=
---- ghackett@bio.umass.edu
=================================================================
======== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 09:04:17 ECT Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Comments:
Resent-From: Charlotte Skuster <SKUSTER@BINGVMB> Comments:
Originally-From: "Elizabeth M. Moys" <betty@moys.demon.co.uk>
From: Charlotte Skuster <SKUSTER@BINGVMB.BITNET> Subject:
Ergonomics, ideas about [plus] In-Reply-To:
<844883330.15467.0@vms.dc.lsoft.com>
>>
>Fine. As far as it goes. I suspect many _INDEXER_ readers also
have fine
>input on ergonomics. I think it would be worth a try for someone
to see if
>the newsletter would agree to a regular column that would
include q and a's
>about ergonomics, plus tips. I envision that one issue's column
would have a
>number of unanswered questions from readers, answers to previous
questions,
>and those floating tips.
>
Fine, also. But why limit the proposed columnn to Ergonomics? Why
not offer Janet a column reporting all the main threads in
Index-L during the appropriate six months? (I am not quite sure
what period that would be, but I'll ask her next time I ring.)
Some items do seem to be rather (dare I say it?) parochial, but
some are of very real general interest to many indexers.
There are several names which I see every week on the list. How
about it ladies (you know who you are, and seem to be, mostly,
ladies)?
This is a friendly suggestion, not a criticism of anyone!
Betty
=================================================================
===
Elizabeth M. Moys email:
betty@moys.demon.co.uk
Phone & Fax: +44 (0)1959-534530
Hengist, Badgers Road, Badgers Mount,
Sevenoaks, Kent, TN14 7AT, England
=================================================================
===
=================================================================
======== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 06:25:05 -0700 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Kari Bero <bero@ALEXIA.LIS.UIUC.EDU> Subject: Re: USDA info
For quick info on the USDA's Correspondence Program, check out
their web site:
http://grad.usda.gov/corres/corpro.html
For info on their _Indexing_ courses, follow this path from their
home page:
Correspondence Program Catalog --> Editing --> Basic
Indexing &
Applied Indexing
Or, you can contact them via phone at: (202) 720-7123
Hope this helps.
-Kari
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- ASI Web
Committee:
Kari Bero (webmaster)
Lori Lathrop
Coleen Mackay
Lynn Moncrief (chair)
Janet Perlman
Charlotte Skuster (ASI board representative)
Neva Smith
Jan Wright (webmaster)
Pilar Wyman
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
=================================================================
======== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 09:21:28 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Marie-Lise Shams <mshams@CIESIN.ORG> Subject: Re: USDA
In-Reply-To: <9610101252.AA12417@ciesin.org>
The USDA Graduate School Web Homepage is at URL:
http://grad.usda.gov/index.html
Marie-Lise
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
^ Marie-Lise Shams ^
^ Information Specialist ^
^ Consortium for International Earth ^
^ Science Information Network (CIESIN) ^
^ 2250 Pierce Road ^
^ University Center Michigan 48710 ^
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
^ Phone: +1-517-797-2790 ^
^ Fax: +1-517-797-2622 ^
^ E-mail: mshams@ciesin.org ^
^ URL: http://www.ciesin.org ^
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
On Thu, 10 Oct 1996, Grant Hackett wrote:
> Quickly--where can I access info. re the USDA course?
> ghackett@bio.umass.edu
> =
> ---- ghackett@bio.umass.edu
>
=================================================================
======== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 09:21:50 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Hazel Blumberg-McKee <hazelcb@POLARIS.NET> Subject: Re: USDA
In-Reply-To: <199610101252.IAA14353@polaris.net>
On Thu, 10 Oct 1996, Grant Hackett wrote:
> where can I access info. re the USDA course?
Take a look at ASI's home page, the URL of which is
http://www.well.com/user/asi
You can contact the USDA Grad School Correspondence Program at
correspond@grad.usda.gov
Hope this helps.
Hazel
Hazel Blumberg-McKee (hazelcb@polaris.net)
"I am ruled by my cats."--Norman O'Toole
=================================================================
======== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 08:39:23 -0500 Reply-To:
becohen@prairienet.org
Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET>
From: "Barbara E. Cohen" <becohen@PRAIRIENET.ORG>
Subject: Re: Subentry order, scholarly (help?)
Victoria:
Yes, this is a standard order of subheadings for some publishers
I work for. If you are using Cindex, you can set the sort order
to accommodate this request.
Barbara
--
Barbara E. Cohen
Indexing & Editorial Services
Champaign, IL
=================================================================
======== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 08:48:14 -0500 Reply-To:
becohen@prairienet.org
Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET>
From: "Barbara E. Cohen" <becohen@PRAIRIENET.ORG>
Subject: Re: subheading order
Another thought on this topic, now that I have read through the
other responses to this query:
I am not offended if the publisher asked for a sort order other
than alphabetical, especially as some kinds of books other than
biographical may be reasonably scanned in page-number-sorted
order.
Many historical books, of course, lend themselves to this
treatment, but sometimes alphabetical order is no more helpful,
esp. when the synonyms available for writing the subheadings have
equal value.
Why should one prefer:
Apple pie:
attorneys' preference for,
over Apple pie:
lawyers' preference for,
(imagine a long list of occupations with synonym choices, and you
can see that the list has no inherent order.... a page-sorted
order MIGHT be just as searchable, and may have some coherence,
such as listing all professional-level occupations before all
blue-collar ones in a book on eating preferences).
Anyway, what I'm trying to say is that slavish devotion to any
one format is always a bad idea. Evaluate the material you are
indexing to find the best choice for that topic and selection of
information about that topic.
Trying to be open-minded about the rules...
Barbara
--
Barbara E. Cohen
Indexing & Editorial Services
Champaign, IL
=================================================================
======== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 06:58:10 -0700 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Pam Rider <prider@POWERGRID.ELECTRICITI.COM> Subject:
NOTICE, RE: column
NOTICE:
Pam Rider has never expressed on the list or elsewhere any
interest in writing any column in any newsletter for any group in
the past month.
She has presented an idea for format of a possible column. In
essence, whether there is or is not a column and the format of
such a proprosal is for the newsletter editor to make.
At 09:04 AM 10/10/96 ECT, you wrote:
>>>
>>Fine. As far as it goes. I suspect many _INDEXER_ readers also
have fine
>>input on ergonomics. I think it would be worth a try for
someone to see if
>>the newsletter would agree to a regular column that would
include q and a's
>>about ergonomics, plus tips. I envision that one issue's column
would have a
>>number of unanswered questions from readers, answers to
previous questions,
>>and those floating tips.
>>
>Fine, also. But why limit the proposed columnn to Ergonomics?
Why not
>offer Janet a column reporting all the main threads in Index-L
during
>the appropriate six months? (I am not quite sure what period
that would
>be, but I'll ask her next time I ring.) Some items do seem to be
rather
>(dare I say it?) parochial, but some are of very real general
interest
>to many indexers.
>
>There are several names which I see every week on the list. How
about it
>ladies (you know who you are, and seem to be, mostly, ladies)?
>
>This is a friendly suggestion, not a criticism of anyone!
>
>Betty
>================================================================
====
> Elizabeth M. Moys email:
betty@moys.demon.co.uk
> Phone & Fax: +44 (0)1959-534530
> Hengist, Badgers Road, Badgers Mount,
> Sevenoaks, Kent, TN14 7AT, England
>================================================================
====
>
>
Pam Rider
Trying to walk cheerfully on the Earth
prider@powergrid.electriciti.com
prider@tsktsk.com
http://www.electriciti.com:80/~prider/
=================================================================
======== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 09:24:25 LCL Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
perdue susan h <shperd@FACSTAFF.WM.EDU> Subject: subentry
order
Greetings:
I have been a list lurker on Index-L for some time and have
really enjoyed it. I am currently working with a documentary
editing project the Papers of John Marshall having come from the
Papers of James Madison. While at the Madison Papers I indexed
about five volumes of the papers. Not only did I convert the
project to CINDEX, but I also converted them from numerically
ordered subentries to alphabetically ordered subentries.
Although someone's papers could be considered biographical, one
volume only covers about six months so the assumption that early
pages cover the subject's birth, pages 20-30 cover the subject's
early childhood, and 40-50 cover the subject's college education,
doesnt'always fit. You get the idea. I think it was through
habit that they indexed with subentries numerically ordered. The
publisher, University of Virginia Press, didn't seem to care
either way. Working with subentries alphabetically is much
easier for the indexer as well as the reader, as I found. My
comments come a little late in the game, but FWIW.
Sue Perdue
John Marshall Papers
shperd@facstaff.wm.edu
=================================================================
======== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 10:43:29 -0500 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
"laura m. gottlieb" <pgottlie@FACSTAFF.WISC.EDU> Subject:
subentry order, scholarly
10 October 1996
The University of North Carolina Press is another press that asks
for subentries in chronological, rather than alphabetical, order.
They too base their preference on the arbitrariness of
alphabetical synonyms. And, as Barbara Cohen said, CINDEX has the
ability to sort chronologically, so it's not hard to provide what
they want. I much prefer alphabetical sorts myself, but when I
started indexing in 1982, chronological sorts seemed to be the
standard and I did them frequently.
Laura Moss Gottlieb
Freelance Indexer
=================================================================
======== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 10:48:08 -0500 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
"laura m. gottlieb" <pgottlie@FACSTAFF.WISC.EDU> Subject:
ergonomic exercises
10 October 1996
As someone who never had a moment's pain in my wrists in all my
many years of indexing *until* this discussion of ergonomics came
up on this thread (so is my current discomfort in my head or in
my wrists??), I would very much like to read the directions for
exercises mentioned by Victoria Baker. I imagine that I'm not
the only one who'd be interested in this either, so please
address them to the list. And thanks in advance!
Laura Moss Gottlieb
Freelance Indexer
=================================================================
======== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 11:15:32 -0600 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Carol Roberts <Carol.Roberts@MIXCOM.COM> Subject: Re:
Subentry order, scholarly (help?)
I've replied to Victoria off-list at more length, but I just want
to make the following observation here: sometimes production
editors send out guidelines (perhaps without even looking them
over first) that are out of date. Just an old set of guidelines,
some of which are no longer the press's preferences. Whenever you
see something odd like that, it's always worth checking with the
production editor to make sure that's what she or he really
wants.
Cheers,
Carol Roberts, indexer and copy editor | Life is good.
Carol.Roberts@mixcom.com | Milwaukee, WI
|
=================================================================
======== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 11:20:54 -0500 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
sandy@PCLOGICONLINE.COM
Subject: CINDEX HELP
I purchased the trial CINDEX edition and tried it out on my own
using the manual that accompanied it. I am looking for a short
course or an individual who lives/works on Cindex in my area
(Chester County, Pennsylvania) who could demonstrate it to me.
TIA Sandy Sadow
sandy@pclogiconline.com
=================================================================
======== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 12:45:24 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Hazel Blumberg-McKee <hazelcb@POLARIS.NET> Subject: Erg.
computer desk
Reina Pennington had written about her computer cart, which has a
slanted work surface and a pull-out keyboard drawer; she also
mentioned that it's on wheels. I'd never seen such a marvelous
thing. And lo! There it was in an advertisement from Lowe's, a
home-improvement store, for the excellent price of $89.95. I went
out and looked at it (it's made by Souder (sp?)); looks terrific.
A similar such cart, made by O'Sullivan, was available at the
local Service Merchandise for $119.95 through their catalog.
This isn't an endorsement of any brands or stores. Just wanted to
let you know where such desks are available, if you have these
stores in your area, and if you're desk hunting. I'm hoping to
trade in my collapsing desk soon.
Hazel
Hazel Blumberg-McKee (hazelcb@polaris.net)
"I am ruled by my cats."--Norman O'Toole
=================================================================
======== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 13:19:01 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
"Karl E. Vogel" <vogelke@C17.WPAFB.AF.MIL> Organization: Control
Data Systems Inc.
Subject: Re: Bifocals and ergonomics (NOTE: this reply is
LONG)
>> On Tue, 8 Oct 1996 09:18:10 -0400, you said:
H> I have carpal tunnel syndrome in my left hand. My doctor had
suggested H> noninvasive possibilities: ergonomic keyboard,
lowering the height of the H> keyboard, wearing a brace on my
left arm when I'm not working, and the like, H> before
considering surgery.
My wrists were acting up badly, and the two things that helped
the most were
a. Buying a good keyboard wrist-support, and
b. Taking 3 minutes a day to do a set of complete
range-of-motion wrist
exercises with really small dumb-bells (3 pounds or less).
Holding the
weights palm-up and rolling them from fingertip to palm
and back really
did the trick.
There's a really good FAQ list on typing injuries at
rtfm.mit.edu which
includes nifty stuff on keyboards, etc. I'm enclosing some of
the
references and URLs after my signature. The full version of
this list can
be found at
ftp://rtfm.mit.edu/pub/usenet-by-group/news.answers/typing-injury
-faq/general
--
Karl Vogel vogelke@c17.wpafb.af.mil
513-255-3688 Control Data Systems, Inc. ASC/YCOA,
Wright-Patterson AFB, OH 45433
I wrote a few children's books...not on purpose. --Steven
Wright
=================================================================
===========
From: Dan Wallach <dwallach@CS.Princeton.EDU> Newsgroups:
sci.med,sci.med.occupational,comp.human-factors,comp.answers,
sci.answers,news.answers
Subject: Typing Injury FAQ (2/6): General Info Summary:
information about where to get more information
Archive-name: typing-injury-faq/general Version: $Revision: 5.23
$ $Date: 1995/10/17 07:41:35 $ URL:
http://www.cs.princeton.edu/~dwallach/tifaq/general.html
Prologue
This FAQ may be cited as:
Wallach, Dan S. (1995) "Typing Injury FAQ: General
Information".
http://www.cs.princeton.edu/~dwallach/tifaq/general.html
World-Wide-Web users will find this available as hypertext:
* http://www.cs.princeton.edu/~dwallach/tifaq/general.html
* (Dan Wallach's page) http://www.cs.princeton.edu/~dwallach/
Answers To Frequently Asked Questions about Typing Injuries
The Typing Injury FAQ - sources of information for people with
typing injuries, repetitive stress injuries, carpal tunnel
syndrome, etc.
Copyright 1992-1995 Dan Wallach <dwallach@CS.Princeton.EDU>
[Current distribution: sci.med.occupational, sci.med,
comp.human-factors, {news,sci,comp}.answers, and e-mail to
c+health@iubvm.ucs.indiana.edu, sorehand@vm.ucsf.edu, and
cstg-L@vtvm1.cc.vt.edu]
-----------------------------------------------------------------
--------------
Publications, mailing lists, newsgroups, WWW pointers, etc.
(thanks to Rik Ahlberg <rik@world.std.com> for parts of this
info)
1. Publications
CTDNews is a monthly newsletter that covers cumulative
trauma disorder.
It's a bit pricey ($146/year) but fairly concise. They'll
send you your
first issue free, so you can look it over.
Address
CTDNews
PO Box 239
Haverford, PA 10941
Phone
215-896-4902, or 800-554-4CTD to order
Fax
215-896-1488
WWW
http://wanda.pond.com/mall/ctdnews/rsi
2. FTP & Gopher & WWW sites
world.std.com
The home of the Boston RSI Archive
ftp://ftp.std.com/pub/boston-rsi
gopher://gopher.std.com/11/FTP/world/pub/boston-rsi
Boston RSI changed its name to RSI-East, and the new
archives are at
sjuvm.stjohns.edu (detailed below) The RSI Network
Newsletter is a
bi-monthly online newsletter produced by Caroline Rose
<crose@applelink.apple.com> and distributed online by
Craig O'Donnell
<dadadata@world.std.com>
ftp://ftp.std.com/pub/rsi
gopher://gopher.std.com/11/FTP/world/pub/rsi
ftp.csua.berkeley.edu
Extensive anonymous ftp archive, including the typing
injury FAQ
(frequently asked questions), alternative input device
information
(descriptions, reviews, and GIF images), and some
software.
Maintained by Dan Wallach <dwallach@CS.Princeton.EDU>.
ftp://ftp.csua.berkeley.edu/pub/typing-injury
(more info below...)
sjuvm.stjohns.edu
A gopher site containing the Electronic Rehabilitation
Resource
Center. Lots of disability information, including a
searchable
database of national disability resources and access to
other gopher
sites with geographically local disability information.
Also home to RSI-East, its message archive, and an
archive of the RSI
Network Newsletter.
gopher://sjuvm.stjohns.edu/11/disabled
ftp.demon.co.uk
An ftp site containing the archives of RSI-UK.
ftp://ftp.demon.co.uk/pub/rsi
Also, Demon now mirrors the typing-injury archive:
ftp://ftp.demon.co.uk/pub/mirrors/csua/typing-injury
engr-www.unl.edu
A World-Wide-Web page with some good pictures of how to
hold your
hands, MPEG videos of various exercises, and more.
http://engr-www.unl.edu/ee/eeshop/rsi.html
Other WWW sites:
The Ergonomic Page, from Applied Software Unlimited [-
NEW!]
http://www.best.com:80/~ergoware/
Emacs keybindings and ergonomics [- NEW!]
http://www.santafe.edu/~nelson/ergo/
Amara's RSI Page [- NEW!]
http://www.amara.com/aboutme/rsi.html
MouseMitt International - padded lycra wrist braces [-
NEW!]
http://www.mousemitt.com/
Workstation Environments - a company which designs
high-end furniture
[- NEW!]
http://www.workenv.com/
Safety Related Internet Resources [- NEW!]
http://www.sas.ab.ca/biz/christie/safelist.html
Some human factors and ergonomics research by Alan
Hedge
http://www.tc.cornell.edu/~hedge
TechTime articles on RSI Injuries
http://hoohana.aloha.net/~billpeay/TECHT08.html
A Patient's Guide to Carpal Tunnel Syndrome
http://www.cyberport.net/mmg/cts/ctsintro.html
Medical Matrix - A Guide to Internet Medical Resources
http://kuhttp.cc.ukans.edu/cwis/units/medcntr/Lee/HOMEPAGE.HTML
ErgoWeb - lots of information for designers of
ergonomic tools
http://ergoweb.mech.utah.edu/
Oversensitivity to Electricity
http://www.isy.liu.se/~tegen/febost.html
Disability Resources from Evan Kemp Associates
http://disability.com/
Intergraph Workstation Furniture
http://www.intergraph.com/furn.shtml
Safe Computing's Internet Store - buy ergonomic
products online
http://www.netmedia.com/safe/
The Martial Arts FAQ
http://www.cis.ohio-state.edu/hypertext/faq/usenet/martial-arts/t
op.html
The Ergonomic Sciences Corp, Mountain View, CA.
http://www.internex.net/multipresence/ergonomics.html
The (USA's) Occupational Safety and Health
Administration
http://www.osha.gov
Canadian Centre for Occupational Health and Safety
http://www.ccohs.ca
Repetitive Stress Injury Help Page (CMU)
http://http://www.cs.cmu.edu/afs/cs.cmu.edu/help/www/06-Miscellan
eous/RSI/repst rTOC.html
Some other WWW indices to the typing-injury archive
http://www.santafe.edu/~nelson/rsi/typing-gif.html
http://alumni.caltech.edu/~dank/typing-archive.html
The FAQ for a2x (a program to interface an external
keyboard or
speech synthesizer to an X window system) and the FAQ
for
DragonDictate (a speech recognition system) are both
available here.
http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/a2x-voice/ (this should
include
information on the new a3x software which works
with Windows NT
instead of Unix and X)
ftp://ftp.cl.cam.ac.uk/a2x-voice/
Another RSI page in the works
http://dragon.acadiau.ca:1667/~rob/rsi/rsi.html
Magnetic Devices from Total Health Mktg., Nikken
Independent
Distributors
http://www.icw.com/~total/health.html
3. Listserv Mailing Lists
Sorehand is a San Francisco-based listserv mailing list for
people with
RSIs. Subscribe by sending mail with any subject to:
listserv@itssrv1.ucsf.edu
with the message body reading:
subscribe sorehand Your Name
C+Health (Computers & Health) is a listserv mailing list
which deals with
the technologies causing injuries to folks who use them.
Subscribe by
sending mail with any subject to:
listserv@iubvm.ucs.indiana.edu
with the message body reading:
subscribe c+health Your Name
RSI-East is the east coast's answer to sorehand, where users
discuss their
experiences and offer support, referral, and treatment
information to one
another. Subscriptions are available to anyone with an
interest in RSIs,
but with the caveat that the list is intended as a regional
resource for
networking. Subscribe by sending mail with any subject to:
listserv@sjuvm.stjohns.edu
with the message body reading:
subscribe rsi-east Your Name
RSI-UK is Great Britain's RSI mailing list, open to anyone.
Subscribe by
sending mail with any subject to:
listserv@tictac.demon.co.uk
with the message body reading:
subscribe rsi-uk Your Name
Also, check out the RSI-UK Web page: [- NEW!]
http://www.demon.co.uk/rsi/
4. Usenet Newsgroups
misc.health.therapy.occupational
The successor to sci.med.occupational.
sci.med.occupational
A Usenet newsgroup which deals in occupational
medicine. Lots of
practitioners read it!
comp.human-factors
Mostly software design, but occasional discussion of
accessibility
issues for people with RSIs.
alt.support.arthritis
Support for those with arthritis. New as of 11/93.
bit.listserv.ada-law
Usenet feed of the ada-law listserv. Covers issues
relating to the
Americans with Disabilities Act (ADA).
bit.listserv.dsshe-l
Usenet feed of the disabled student services listserv.
Particularly
of interest to computer science students dealing with
RSIs or folks
pondering a return to school and/or retraining after a
disabling RSI.
5. Real-time chatting
If you've got an account on America On-Line, you might want
to check out
the RSI Support Group, which meets every Wednesday night in
the Equal
Access Cafe. This realtime chat starts at 9:15pm eastern
time. Check the
current AOL schedule for the most current information.
6. Books / Literature
A large amount has been written in the popular press and the
medical
literature, and more comprehensive bibliographies
(rsi.biblio and
rsi.biblio2) are available in the typing-injury archive.
Here are some books you might want to check out:
o Emil Pascarelli and Deborah Quilter, Repetitive Strain
Injury, a
Computer User's Guide, John Wiley & Sons, ISBN
0-471-59533-0.
+ The Pascarelli book is often cited in various
on-line
conversations. If you buy only one book, this is
probably the
one to get.
o Don Sellers, Zap! How Your Computer Can Hurt You-And
What You Can Do
About It, Peachpit Press, Inc., 1994. ISBN#
1-55609-021-0. Author's
e-mail: dsellers@netcom.com
o Stephanie Brown, Preventing Computer Injury: The Hand
Book, Ergonome
Press, 1993, ISBN 1-884388-01-9.
o David Zemach-Bersin et al., Relaxercise, Harper Press,
1990, ISBN
0-06-250992-6
o Bonnie Prudden, Pain Erasure - The Bonnie Prudden Way.
M. Evans &
Co., Inc., 1980; ISBN 0-87131-328-6 (hardcover).
Ballantine Books,
Inc.; 1982 (softcover).
o Martin Sussman et al., Total Health at the Computer.
Station Hill
Press, 1993.
o Don Aslett, Make Your House Do The Housework, Digest
Books, 1986.
ISBN 0-89-879227-4. 201 pages.
o Sharon Butler, Conquering Carpal Tunnel Syndrome (&
other RSIs),
Advanced Press (no ISBN, but phone 800-909-9795, pay
$18.95 +
shipping). Author's e-mail: SButler100@aol.com
o A free packet of information is also available from the
U.S.
Government. You might want to ask for:
Carpal Tunnel Syndrome
Selected References (March 1989)
NIOSH Publications Dissemination
4676 Columbia Parkway
Cincinnati, Ohio 45226
Alternatively, you can call NIOSH's 800 number:
800-356-4674
(800-35-NIOSH) or poke around their WWW page:
http://www.cdc.gov/niosh/homepage.html [- NEW!]
-----------------------------------------------------------------
--------------
The ftp.csua.berkeley.edu archive
Check out the ever-increasing typing injury archive! Just use
anonymous ftp or WWW:
* ftp://ftp.csua.berkeley.edu/pub/typing-injury
* http://www.cs.princeton.edu/~dwallach/tifaq/archive.html
Informative files:
typing-injury-faq/
changes
changes since last month's edition
general
information about typing injuries
keyboards1 and keyboards2
products to replace your keyboard
software
software to watch your keyboard usage
furniture
details about various desks, chairs, etc.
adapting-at-home
some simple ways to make things like mopping and tooth
brushing less
painful
alexander-vs-feldenkrais [- NEW!]
Mike Mossey compares two healing techniques amt.advice
about Adverse Mechanical Tension
amt.more_info
e-mail from Dr. Peter Bower about this stuff amt.references
a bibliography for more AMT info
ansi-standards
a note about ANSI/ISO, EC, and MIL-STD "standards" armrests
how to correctly use armrests
arms-blurb
info about the Assoc for Rep. Motion Syndromes
back-exercises
three simple exercises for your middle back biofeedback
learning to listen to your body
car-seats
replace your car seat with something more comfortable
caringforwrists.sit.hqx
PageMaker4 document about your wrists caringforwrists.ps
PostScript converted version of above...
carpal.info
info on Carpal Tunnel Syndrome
carpal-myths
a discussion of what carpal tunnel syndrome is and isn't
carpal.explained
very detailed information about CTS carpal-new-therapy
new treatments that don't involve surgery carpal.self_care
excerpt from Rosemarie Atencio's book carpal-steroid-therapy
abstract of a paper discussing steroid (cortisone)
treatments for CTS carpal-story
one person's story of CTS diagnosis, treatment, and recovery
carpal.surgery
JAMA article on CTS surgery
carpal-surgery-tips
some general tips for recovering from the surgery
carpal.tidbits
TidBITS article on CTS
ctdnews.info
info about the CTDNews publication chord-keyboards
interesting facts and references to more
cumulative-disorders
Cumulative Trauma Disorders: Are They Preventable? Yes, No,
Maybe - a
paper by Joy Linn
disability.keyboards
large list of keyboards, more relevant for users with motion
disabilities disability-mailing-lists
large list of mailing lists for a various disabilities
double-crush
double-crush syndrome, CTS, and more dragon-vocab-size
should you buy the version with a bigger dictionary?
dragon-vs-kurzweil
a detailed comparison of both voice systems
dragon-vs-kurzweil2 [- NEW!]
an even more detailed comparison of the two systems
dvorak.info
lots of into about Dvorak keyboarding exercise-discussion
exercise in the workplace
exotic-mice
info on some newer mice
feldenkrais-info
some background info on how the Feldenkrais method can ease
stress footswitch.doc
how to hack a footswitch into your computer
footswitch-sources
where to buy a footswitch
glare-control
hints about controling glare from your screen glidepoint
lots of information on the GlidePoint trackpad pointing
device guitar-playing
RSI vs. playing guitar
handeze.info
info about Handeze gloves
hmo-advice
advice on picking a health-care provider in the USA
industrial-injury
one person's story of an injury
injury.factors
why some get injured and some don't injury.profiles
statistics about what gets injured internet-safety-resources
a huge list of pointers to Internet resources
keyboard-commentary
Dan's (increasingly ancient and outdated) opinions on the
keyboard
replacements
keyboard-companies [- NEW!]
Simpson Garfinkel's article about companies building new
keyboards keyboard-trays
all about picking a good tray
kinesis-sun-mappings
some useful xmodmap calls when using a Kinesis Sun adapter
box martial-arts
using martial arts to combat RSI's
microsoft-vs-generic-split
comparison of Microsoft Natural and Taiwanese generic split
keyboards mouseless.mac
keyboard shortcuts and tricks
nervous-system-anatomy
basic information on how the human nervous system works
no-rsi-in-uk
info about British judge saying RSI isn't real
nonsurgical-treatment [- NEW!]
Various nonsurgical treatment options for upper extremity
overuse injuries office-safety
Worker-oriented solutions to office safety pain-discussion
All about pain
piano-posture
Some observations about professional pianists
pointing-devices
advice if pointing devices are your problem physical-therapy
explanations of different types of physical therapy
resellers
a short list of dealers and consultants rock-climbing
lots of advice about how to climb without hurting yourself
rsi.article
Article in The Independent (London, UK) rsi.biblio
bibliography of RSI-related publications rsi.biblio2
another bibliography
rsi.dentists
stats on RSI happening to dentists rsi.details
long detailed information about RSI rsi-fda-seminar
Dr. Leo Rozmaryn of the US Food and Drug Administration's
seminar on RSI's rsi.foundation
an attempt to start a U.S. advocacy group rsi.intro
basic article from FDA Consumer
rsi-network/*
archive of the RSI Network newsletter (currently, containing
issues 1
through 19)
rsi.physical
study showing RSI isn't just psychological speed-kills
it's better to type slower
sword.review
reviews a Mac program to reduce keystrokes tendonitis.info
info on Tendonitis
thoracic-info
info about thoracic outlet syndrome (TOS) thoracic-info2
more info about thoracic outlet syndrome thoracic-info3
treatment info, exercises, and more (useful for many folks)
uk-rsi-resources
RSI resources in Great Britain
vibration-gloves
why anti-vibration gloves aren't necessarily helpful
vitamin-b6
possible links between vitamins and RSI's voice-comparison
a brief comparison of recognition systems voice-problems
how to avoid hurting your voice with overuse (as you might
do with a
speech recognition system)
voice-programming
detailed information about the appropriateness of a voice
dictation system
to programming tasks
voice-recognition-critique
all about using a voice recognition system as a programmer
workers-comp
dealing with insurance and lawyers wrist-supports
picking your supports and splints
Various product literature and reviews:
apple-press
press release on the Apple Adjustable Keyboard apple-tidbits
extensive info about Apple's Adjustable Keybd bat-info
MacWeek review on the Bat
comfort-factors, comfort-features, comfort-letter, and
comfort-survey
marketing info on the Comfort Keyboard comfort-review
one user's personal opinions
comfort-review2
another user's opinions
datahand-review
detailed opinions of the DataHand
datahand-review2
follow-up to above
datahand-review3
another review of the DataHand
datahand-desc
description of the DataHand's appearance dragon2.info
info about DragonDictate 2.0
in3-press
details about the IN3 Voice Commander keyboard-phone-numbers
[- NEW!]
Tom Bell's list of keyboard vendor phone numbers
kinesis-review
one user's personal opinions
kinesis-review2
another user's personal opinions
kinesis-summary
a collection of opinions on the Kinesis kinesis-vs-maltron
a comparison of two similar keyboard alternatives
kurzweil-review
info about the Kurzweil voice recognizer maltron-flyer and
maltron-letter
marketing info on various Maltron products maltron-review
one user's personal opinions
mskeybd-review
one user's personal opinions of the Microsoft Natural
Keyboard ncc-digital-dictate [- NEW!]
the Digital Dictate add-on for IBM VoiceType vertical-info
marketing info on the Vertical
voicetype2-info
marketing info on IBM VoiceType
worksafe-australia.info
how to get more info from Australia's govt workstation-setup
how to arrange your computer/chair/desk
wrist-rest-phone-numbers [- NEW!]
Tom Bell's list of wrist rest vendor phone numbers
Programs (in the software subdirectory):
UNIX/X Software:
(Note: a2x.tar and rk.tar are both from ftp://ftp.x.org/contrib/
so they may have a more current version than
ftp.csua.berkeley.edu.)
a2x.tar
a more sophisticated X keyboard/mouse spoofing program.
Supports
DragonDictate.
a2x-RawPC-1.4.tar
a hacked version of a2x that can take input directly from PC
keyboards via
the serial port and an adapter.
dcm.shar
Dragon voice macros to accompany a2x use hsh.shar
a program for one-handed usage of normal keyboards kt18.tar
generates fake X keyboard events from the serial port - use
a PC keyboard
on anything!
rest-reminder.sh
yet another idle watcher
rk.tar
the reactive keyboard - predicts what you'll type next -
saves typing serkey.sh
like kt, generates fake X key events, but from a raw PC
keyboard via the
serial port
spacebar_hacks.patches
patches for X11R5 to allow the spacebar to be both a
spacebar and a
control key
timeout.zip
MS Windows break-reminder program
typewatch.shar
tells you when to take a break
xgdvorak.sh
turns your QWERTY keyboard into Dvorak xidle.shar
keeps track of how long you've been typing xwrits.tar
X-Windows program which pops up and tells you to take a
break.
watch.shar
OpenWindows activity monitor / rest reminder
PC/DOS Software:
accpak.exe
a serial port keyboard spoofer for MS Windows getup.com
getup.readme
simple TSR program - remind you to take breaks
Pictures (in the gifs subdirectory):
(Note: you can see inlined images of these keyboards in the
keyboards FAQ document)
howtosit.gif
picture of good sitting posture (the caringforwrists
document is better
for this)
half-qwerty.gif (new name, same file as old 1handpic.gif)
keymappings for the Half-QWERTY
accukey1.gif
beautiful grey-scale picture
accukey2.gif
chord-mappings for the accukey
apple.gif
the Apple Adjustable Keyboard
bat.gif
the InfoGrip Bat
comfort.gif
the Health Care Comfort Keyboard
datahand1.gif
picture of the keyboard
datahand2.gif
key layout schematic
E2H_Grahl.gif
Grahl split-back ergonomic chair
E_Grahl.gif
Grahl normal-back ergonomic chair
ergologic.gif
the ergoLogic 7.1 keyboard (same as flexpro) ergomaster1.gif
and ergomaster2.gif
the Genovation ErgoMaster keyboard ergomax.gif
the Maxi Switch ErgoMax keyboard
flexpro.gif
the Key Tronic FlexPro keyboard (same as ergologic)
fountain_hills.gif
the Fountain Hills keyboard
generic-split.gif
a generic keyboard, made in Taiwan handeze.gif
hand size chart for Handeze gloves handeze.ps
properly scaled Postscript of handeze.gif kinesis.gif
the Kinesis Ergonomic Keyboard
lexmark.gif
the Lexmark Select-Ease keyboard
maltron1.gif, maltron2.gif, maltron3.gif, and maltron4.gif
several pictures of Maltron products marquardt.gif
the Marquardt MiniErgo
mskeybd.gif
the Microsoft Natural Keyboard
mskeybd-proto.gif
... and a prototype that didn't make it mykey.gif
ErgonomiXX MyKey
somers1.gif
Somers EK1 Ergonomic Keyboard
somers2.gif
schematic picture of the keyboard
tony.gif
The Tony! Ergonomic Keysystem
twiddler1.gif
Twiddler, "front" view
twiddler2.gif
Twiddler, "side" view
vertical.gif
the Vertical keyboard
wave.gif
the Iocomm `Wave' keyboard
Many files are compressed (have a .Z ending). If you can't
uncompress a file locally, ftp.csua.berkeley.edu will do it. Just
ask for the file, without the .Z extension.
-----------------------------------------------------------------
--------------
References
Much of the information here is derived from a wonderful guide
produced in New Zealand by their Occupational Safety & Health
Service, a service of their Department of Labour. Special thanks
to the authors: Wigley, Turner, Blake, Darby, McInnes, and
Harding.
Semi-bibliographic reference:
* Occupational Overuse Syndrome
Treatment and Rehabilitation:
A Practitioner's Guide
Published by the Occupational Safety and Health Service
Department of Labour
Wellington, New Zealand.
First Edition: June 1992
ISBN 0-477-3499-3
Price: $9.95 (New Zealand $'s, of course)
=================================================================
======== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 10:37:38 -0700 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Elinor Lindheimer <elinorl@MCN.ORG> Subject: subentry order
Victoria,
The University of California Press only used page-number
order for subentries when I started indexing in 1972. There's an
option in the sort menu of Macrex for it. It's strange, yes, but
not unheard of, and it can look logical once you get used to it.
Good luck!
Elinor Lindheimer
elinorl@mcn.org
=================================================================
======== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 14:52:07 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Craig Brown <104571.560@COMPUSERVE.COM> Subject: Index as
database
I got a call today from an editor who is looking into a project
in which the indexer will create the index entries by tagging
them with SGML in an electronic text. The entries will then be
used to create a database. If I understand correctly, the
database will be used both to allow electronic access to the text
and to create a freestanding printed index. The editor's
question is what, if anything, can be done to resolve the usual
issues of index usability. Examples are to eliminate scattering
of terminology, to apply appropriate cross references, to resolve
synonyms (e.g, doctors and physicians), and so on. I ventured
the opinion that it is still an activity requiring individual
judgment, and that each time the electronic text changes, the
final editing activity would have to be done by someone with
indexing skills. Since this isn't an area of expertise for me,
though, I offered to post this query on Index-L. I am also
providing my editor with subscription information for Index-L.
Would anyone like to offer commentary?
TIA,
Craig Brown
The Last Word
=================================================================
======== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 12:45:42 -0700 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
"Nancy C. Mulvany" <nmulvany@WELL.COM> Subject: Submissions
to The Indexer
Hi Everyone,
I am posting a reminder about submission procedures for The
Indexer. A more thorough description of "Notes for Contributors"
is printed on the inside front cover of the 1996 issues.
Janet Shuter (shuter@cix.compulink.co.uk) is the Editor of The
Indexer. You may send short items and queries about Regular
Feature contributions to her. See the front cover of the 1996
issues for a listing of Regular Features. If you have an idea
about adding a new feature department to The Indexer, write to
Janet.
Nancy Mulvany (nmulvany@well.com) is the Associate Editor of The
Indexer. You may send queries about full length articles to her.
Soon you will be receiving the October 1996 issue of The Indexer.
In this issue the editors describe future theme-oriented issues
of the journal. We invite you to consider contributing.
Nancy Mulvany
Associate Editor, The Indexer
=================================================================
======== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 16:47:34 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
"Richard T. Evans" <infodex@MINDSPRING.COM> Subject: Re:
Index as database
At 02:52 PM 10/10/96 -0400, you wrote:
>I got a call today from an editor who is looking into a project
in which
>the indexer will create the index entries by tagging them with
SGML in an
>electronic text. The entries will then be used to create a
database. If I
>understand correctly, the database will be used both to allow
electronic
>access to the text and to create a freestanding printed index.
The Date: Sun, 17 Nov 1996 20:44:38 +0000 From: BITNET
list server at BINGVMB (1.8a)
<LISTSERV@BINGVMB.cc.binghamton.edu> Subject:
File: "INDEX-L LOG9610B"
To: Julius Ariail <jariail@gsaix2.cc.GaSoU.EDU>
>editor's question is what, if anything, can be done to resolve
the usual
>issues of index usability.
The issues of usability are separate from the mechanics of
creating the index, but SGML presents some of the same concerns
that an indexer has using any imbedded indexing tool. SGML,
however, is more similar to IBM's BookMaster package than it is
to PageMaker, MS-Word, or any of the common word processors. The
similarity is that one has to create individual entries without
being able to see the results intil running a separate compile
step. The advantage of SGML (assuming it is as similar to
BookMaster as I think it is) is that there is a way to create and
view an index structure before actually inserting tags. In IBM,
we called it "central point indexing". It may be known as
something else out in the real world.
I used to be a BookMaster wizard, though I'm a bit rusty now, and
have done my share of indexes with it. I'd be glad to consult on
any specific questions.
Dick Evans
=================================================================
======== Date: Thu, 10 Oct 1996 23:58:07 EDT Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
"FISHER,AMY ELAINE,MS" <SHA4@MUSICB.MCGILL.CA> Subject: yes,
more political correctness
Hi everyone,
This message is for all of you, but especially those who have
been taking part in that rather lively discussion about political
correctness over the past few weeks!
I'm a second-year library science student at McGill University in
Montreal, taking an indexing course as one of my electives. We
have been given the task of writing a paper on some interesting
aspect of indexing; I chose as my topic how political correctness
can affect indexing. Since I seem to be having trouble finding
print articles for my research, I thought I'd ask around for some
assistance. If any of you know some good resources, I'd really
appreciate hearing about them.
Thanks!
Amy E. Fisher
sha4@musicb.mcgill.ca
=================================================================
======== Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 01:32:05 -0700 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Victoria Baker <vbaker@WAONLINE.COM> Subject: Re: yes, more
political correctness
I recommend the cover article of the June 18, 1991 (Vol XXXVI,
No. 25) of *The Village Voice* as a guide to understanding some
of the dynamics and background of the discussion as it was held
on this newsgroup.
--Victoria
=================================================================
======== Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 09:26:42 -0500 Reply-To:
becohen@prairienet.org
Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET>
From: "Barbara E. Cohen" <becohen@PRAIRIENET.ORG>
Subject: Political correctness
This week I have been wrestling with some subheadings in a book
dealing with radical politics (such as the Weather Underground
and the Black Panthers) written by a former New Left activitist
turned neoconservative. Writing the subheadings in a neutral
(non-inflammatory) mode has been interesting!
For example, instead of:
Brown, Elaine
volatile/dangerous personality of, (this is brought out again
and again in the text)
I used:
Brown, Elaine:
personality of,
likewise:
Newton, Huey:
drug use by, rather than "drug abuse by"
In such subtle ways, the index is perhaps more neutral than the
text, without actually changing the ability of the reader to find
the same information.
There were a thousand other examples relating to the author of
the autobiography, where I wanted to say:
Doe, John:
marital problems of, I settled for:
Doe, John:
marriage to X of,
marriage to Y of,
marriage to Z of,
even though the text does go on about his marital problems (note:
the book is dedicated to his current fiance, and the editor and I
agreed to avoid any entries that might be taken as an insult,
even where the author is insulting in the text.)
So, although some of the entries involve being politically
correct, some of them are just attempts to be balanced or
neutral. It's been fun! (This is where I get to feel creative,
but I'm glad every project doesn't require me to examine the
wording of entries so closely.)
Thought for a Friday....
Barbara
--
Barbara E. Cohen
Indexing & Editorial Services
Champaign, IL
=================================================================
======== Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 12:03:49 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Susan Holbert <susanh@WORLD.STD.COM> Subject: Re: wannabe
seeking advice/learning to index
>Shirley Warren writes (in part):
>
>>>How can I best learn indexing? Do I need to take graduate
courses
>in information science or computer programming, or should I just
buy
>second-hand nonfiction books and mark up the pages?
As a person who specializes in indexing training, I believe there
is no one best way to learn indexing. I learned without any
formal training. Many of the indexers I most respect learned on
their own and I think that is a perfectly legitimate way to
become an indexer.
Not all people, however, have the confidence and ability and
opportunity to start indexing on their own. The one-day workshop
and video that I offer is geared toward those people who need
guidance and introduction to the basic principles, both of
indexing and of running a freelance business, and who can
continue to learn on their own. Indexing is a profession that
requires you to get by without much supervision or feedback. A
lot of indexing "types" can get started by being sent in the
right direction and taking it from there.
I have not taken the USDA course, but it seems to me that this
course fulfills a need for those who need more supervision and
feedback. Many successful indexers have started with this course.
For a certain type of person, it gives the confidence needed to
go out and begin indexing.
As far as I have seen, most graduate courses do not teach
back-of-the book indexing per se. Many library school graduates
have taken my course (especially to do back-of-the-book indexing
after retirement). Theory is not the same as practice.
I don't mean to imply that anybody can sit down and figure out
indexing on their own. I train tech writers who have been
indexing for years, and 90% of them have not figured out the
basic concepts. They're amazed to discover that a list of
subentries should not all have the same page numbers. But I do
believe there are many different ways to learn depending on the
personality and learning style of the person.
All indexers keep on learning. This listserve is an example of
that. That's one of the most satisfying things about being an
indexer.
I'd be interested in knowing how many of you started with no
formal training. I've been indexing for 16 years, and it could be
that that's the old-fashioned way.
Regards, Susan
Susan Holbert
INDEXING SERVICES
24 Harris Steet
Waltham, MA 02154-6105
617-893-0514
susanh@world.std.com
"Training workshops and videos"
=================================================================
======== Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 13:03:15 EDT Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
"John R. Sullivan" <104146.1652@COMPUSERVE.COM> Subject:
Ergonomics
Those who have been following the ergonomics thread will find
Cheryl Currid's article in the November issue of Windows magazine
("Is Your PC Out to Get You?) interesting.
John R. Sullivan
Concentric Data Systems
Westborough MA
=================================================================
======== Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 06:40:29 +1300 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Simon Cauchi <cauchi@WAVE.CO.NZ> Subject: Re: subentry order
I have arranged subentries in order of their first page number in
indexes for biographies but not for other kinds of books.
Consider the weakness of alphabetical order in the following
entries, though:
UN World Conferences for Women:
Beijing (1995), 129 ...
Copenhagen (1980), 51...
Mexico City (1975), 51...
Nairobi (1985), 51...
[Chronological order would have been better, and would have been
one acceptable way of doing first-page-number order]
Canada
conference on unpaid work (1993) 96 ...
treatment of refugees 102 ...
value of unpaid work in household 85 ...
women's production in agriculture 68 ...
[The first and last two subentries refer to an essay on "work",
the second to an essay on "human rights"; first-page-number order
would present the entries more helpfully]
Drusilla Calvert in her 1995 Marysville conference paper points
out the idiocy of alphabetical order in such sequences as "cello,
double bass, viola, violin" and "duos, nonets, octets, quartets,
quintets, septets, sextets, trios" and "Jones, Henry: adolescence
... ; birth ...; childhood ... ; death ... ; marriage ...".
Clearly the sensible order for these (down in pitch from violin
to double bass; in increasing-number order from duos to nonets;
in chronological order from birth to death) may or may not
coincide with first-page-number order.
>From Simon Cauchi, 13 Riverview Terrace, Hamilton, New Zealand
Phone & fax +64 7 854 9229 e-mail cauchi@wave.co.nz
=================================================================
======== Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 13:14:43 -0700 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Bonny McLaughlin <MCLAUGHB@CGS.EDU> Subject: Publishing/Work
cycles
Cynthia,
I work almost exclusively for university presses and find that my
busiest season runs from January through June or early July. I
can nearly always plan a vacation for August or early September
and still manage the occasional job that might come in during
that time. Things pick up for me in September/October and the
workload is moderate through the end of the year. I am then
swamped for the January-June period.
Bonny McLaughlin
mclaughb@cgs.edu
=================================================================
======== Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 18:23:00 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Wildefire@AOL.COM
Subject: Re: Publishing/Work cycles
Cynthia,
My experience is that, with traditional publishers, January and
February are pretty dead. Then in March, things start to pick up
with the workload ever increasing throughout the year until it
becomes insane from September through December. From November to
December, many publishers are trying to get books out of the door
and onto the shelves before the end of the year. In terms of my
computer software clients, the months ending the four quarters
seem to be the busiest with them as they're trying to ship a
product before the end of a quarter. (The months ending quarters
seem to punctuate other publishers' cycles, too.)
Lynn Moncrief
TECHindex & Docs
Technical and Scientific Indexing
=================================================================
======== Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 20:08:31 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Janet Russell <CorofinInd@AOL.COM> Subject: What is address
for Index-L Digest?
Can someone send me the instructions for subscribing to Index-L
Digest?
Sorry to disturb the list, but I did check the instructions sent
me when I subscribed to Index-L and it's not there. Thanks.
Janet Russell
Corofin Indexing Services
=================================================================
======== Date: Fri, 11 Oct 1996 22:36:45 -0700 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Elinor Lindheimer <elinorl@MCN.ORG> Subject: Re: learning to
index
Susan Holbert wrote:
>I'd be interested in knowing how many of you started with no
formal
>training. I've been indexing for 16 years, and it could be that
that's the
>old-fashioned way.
I took a ten-week course called "Editorial Workshop" at the
University of California Extension in 1971. The teacher was the
editor-in-chief at the University of California Press. The last
week's class covered indexing.
Then, my first job entailed working on the index with the person
training me. She then hired me to help on another index. Then she
referred me to a job she couldn't take--it was the demography of
the Indians of California for the University of California Press.
From then on, I was on my own, with only the Chicago MANUAL OF
STYLE and WORDS INTO TYPE to help when I had questions.
I believe strongly that some people have a "knack" for indexing,
and some [most] people don't. It's an unusual skill that
requires verbal dexterity, an editorial eye, and an ability to
put yourself inside a reader's mind. The techniques can be
learned, but the art can't.
I've learned a tremendous amount during the years I've been a
member of ASI, both from in-person contacts at meetings and
gatherings and from reading ASI materials.
The USDA course teaches both the skills of indexing and the
process of running an indexing business. It's been a great help
to many, I know.
Elinor Lindheimer
elinorl@mcn.org
=================================================================
======== Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 02:46:50 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
JPerlman@AOL.COM
Subject: Re: learning to index
Susan,
You're right, I think. The road to indexing isn't the same for
all of us.
Here's my story.
My learning to index came as a part of my job as an editorial
supervisor at John Wiley & Sons technical books division. Being
responsible for book production meant that I had these wonderful
Greenwich Village types bringing me shoeboxes of cards called
indexes. They were such free spirits, all of them <little did I
know til much later the joys of self employment!> Anyway, a few
years later, this same publisher got the idea that a technical
encyclopedia should be indexed in-house, and a few of us thought
we could take a stab at it. It intrigued me. We learned by the
seat of our pants, and by studying what previous indexers had
done in the course of their indexing. Most importantly, I guess,
this fell on fertile ground, and one can assume that all of us
who worked on that project had the knack for indexing. We worked
this project, and we were indexers.
When one of the authors who had participated in that encyclopedia
recommended me to a friend of his who needed an index for a
technical journal in the paper field, and subsequently another in
the then-new plastics chemistry field, my career was launched.
No computer, no software, no formal training.
My clients thought I worked miracles. The publishers were
thrilled. I loved it.
After many years of part-time free-lance indexing, having started
my family and moved to Arizona from NYC, I left it all to go on
to other things in life, but none were as satisfying as indexing.
One administrative career later, after a Master's Degree in
Management and frustrated hopes for promotion, I decided to go
back to the intellectual pursuits I loved, and returned to
indexing. That was about 10 years ago. A steep learning curve
(the computer and dedicated indexing software) followed, and the
challenge of re-entering the field. It was slow at first, but
that was OK, as I was still full-time employed at my
administrative job.
Joining ASI, the relationships and networking that brought into
my life, and participation in workshops and conferences became my
formal indexing education. Only then did I begin to read
everything there was to read, and to really polish my skills.
Having re-launched my career, it took a few more years until I
had enough work to leave full-time employment to pursue indexing
full-time. It's been better than wonderful, and I feel as if
I've realized a dream.
Did I go to school to learn? Not at all. But I continue to
read, study, and learn, and have a thriving business, so I guess
I learned well, in the School of Life.
Janet Perlman
Southwest Indexing
=================================================================
======== Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 07:10:04 -0700 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Pam Rider <prider@POWERGRID.ELECTRICITI.COM> Subject: Re:
Political correctness
Barbara provides execellent and worthy examples of ethical
neutrality, to my reading.
Whether her examples fit into contemporary usage of "political
correctness" is subject to question.
At 09:26 AM 10/11/96 -0500, Barbara wrote:
>This week I have been wrestling with some subheadings in a book
>dealing with radical politics (such as the Weather Underground
>and the Black Panthers) written by a former New Left activitist
>turned neoconservative. Writing the subheadings in a neutral
>(non-inflammatory) mode has been interesting!
>
>For example, instead of:
>
>Brown, Elaine
> volatile/dangerous personality of, (this is brought out again
> and again in the text)
>
>I used:
>
>Brown, Elaine:
> personality of,
>
>
Pam Rider
Trying to walk cheerfully on the Earth
prider@powergrid.electriciti.com
prider@tsktsk.com
http://www.electriciti.com:80/~prider/
=================================================================
======== Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 10:15:16 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Hazel Blumberg-McKee <hazelcb@POLARIS.NET> Subject: Learning
to index
In-Reply-To: <199610120156.VAA02110@polaris.net>
On Fri, 11 Oct 1996, Susan Holbert wrote:
> I'd be interested in knowing how many of you started with no
formal
> training. I've been indexing for 16 years, and it could be that
that's the
> old-fashioned way.
I learned indexing on the job. Right after I graduated from law
school, back in 1984, I went to work for West Publishing Company,
then in St.
Paul, Minnesota, as an attorney/legal editor and indexer. West
often started its folks out in the indexing department and then
moved them to other departments. I seemed to fit in in the
indexing department, and there I stayed for most of my 1 1/2
years at West.
Hazel
Hazel Blumberg-McKee (hazelcb@polaris.net)
"Madness takes its toll. Please have exact change."--Internet
aphorism
=================================================================
======== Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 10:19:12 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
"Richard T. Evans" <infodex@MINDSPRING.COM> Subject: Re:
learning to index
>Susan Holbert wrote:
>
>>I'd be interested in knowing how many of you started with no
formal
>>training. I've been indexing for 16 years, and it could be that
that's the
>>old-fashioned way.
I too think one needs a knack for it. I spent my whole life in
the computer industry and my realtionship with indexes dates to
my earliest frustrations as a computer operator trying to find
information in a 12-foot shelf of manuals. Later, I was a tech
writer and got some exposure to what goes into creating an index
and still later I was a human factors engineer running usability
studies on indexes for telecommunications software.
When I left corporate life in '92 I took several tech writing
contracts and wrote computer manuals while billing myself as an
indexing specialist. I offered to critique indexes for other
writers and help them improve their indexes. I soon developed a
reputation among my co-workers, one of whom passed my name to a
local corporation that was looking for a freelance indexer. Four
years later I am no longer doing tech writing. I am still
freelancing for that first indexing client as well as a half
dozen more.
I've been freelancing full time since '94 and do about 50 titles
(20,000 pages??) a year. On top of that, I'm subcontracting
another dozen or so titles per year.
Never had a minute of formal training.
Dick Evans
=================================================================
======== Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 12:06:12 -0700 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Sonsie <sconroy@SLONET.ORG> Subject: Re: wannabe seeking
advice/learning to index
At 12:03 PM 10/11/96 -0400, Susan Holbert wrote:
>I'd be interested in knowing how many of you started with no
formal
>training. I've been indexing for 16 years, and it could be that
that's the
>old-fashioned way.
I've been indexing for about 20 years, and I'm also self-taught.
But I do think it takes a certain type of personality and
thinking-pattern to be able to do this with reasonable ease. Most
people would probably benefit from some formal training, or at
least a thorough reading of one of the excellent books on the
subject (I like Mulvaney's the best) along with some intensive
practice.
I started with a rather elegant rendition ofa shoebox (one of
those heavy board boxes with a fitted lid, about the size of a
library catalog drawer) and a set of steel-reinforced index
cards...and 10,000 lined cards. I got into computers in about
1985 or so, and in 1988 got my own. But it wasn't until I got
Macrex that indexing became more intuitive and interesting and
less a physical rush to completion. (I used to get a horribly
uncomfortable lump on the finger that my pen pressed against when
I wrote; yes, we did have ergonomic problems before computers.)
=Sonsie=
=================================================================
======== Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 15:41:38 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Wildefire@AOL.COM
Subject: Re: Political correctness
In a message dated 96-10-12 10:10:56 EDT, Pam wrote:
>
> Barbara provides execellent and worthy examples of ethical
neutrality, to my
> reading.
>
> Whether her examples fit into contemporary usage of "political
correctness"
> is subject to question.
Not according to how I define the term "PC". And I think Barbara
did a fantastic job of handling those entries. We're talking
master craftsmanship here on her part--a sterling example of
indexing at its very best. :-) And I don't think that my
judgement is biased by the fact that I personally knew Elaine
Brown and knew folks who knew her and never heard of her being
characterized the way the author did. So, Barbara performed a
wonderful service for folks like me who would read that book, use
the index, and not have to be re-inflamed by finding the author's
apparent vitriol reiterated in the index. (I know that's an
awkward sentence, but I haven't had enough coffee yet to fix it.)
<<Pssst, Barbara, if the rest of the index is that great, you
should submit it for the Wilson award!>>
Lynn Moncrief
TECHindex & Docs
Technical and Scientific Indexing
=================================================================
======== Date: Sat, 12 Oct 1996 17:47:10 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
LLFEdServ@AOL.COM
Subject: Re: learning to index
It seems that the thread that ties us is our "knack" for
indexing. I too have that knack, and I was never formally
trained. I started my publishing life as a production editor for
the college division of HBJ (now HB). I worked with freelance
indexers and proofreaders and edited indexes. When my division
got shipped to Fort Worth, I elected to stay in San Diego and
freelance. Rather than be just another freelance editor, I
decided to try my hand at indexing.
I reread Chicago's indexing chapter and away I went. No one to
call for help, no one to train me... and yet, all my clients
profess to be very pleased with the results. I must admit that I
think about taking a course every so often.
I wonder if there are ways I might improve or ways I might expand
my business with more training. Then I think about the time
involved, my present work schedule, and my financial demands, and
I put the training off until another day.
Leslie
Leslie Leland Frank Editorial Services
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======== Date: Sun, 13 Oct 1996 10:18:03 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
"Cynthia D. Bertelsen" <cbertel@NRV.NET> Subject: Question
on biographical-historical type index
I am indexing a book written in the first person about
historically-important third parties with whom the
author/narrator has worked. There are numerous observations made
throughout the book, like "Later I learned that in his private
talks with Gorbachev..." and "When I contacted 10 Downing Street,
I was told that the prime minister was out of his office and that
they did not know when they could talk to him. I suspected that
Major's office was reluctant to commit their boss to a telephone
conversation of some sticky issue..., etc." There are literally
countless observations and asides like this about people and
events. The book is not really about the narrator, but on the
other hand it is, because his activities vis a vis the events and
people of the times are related.
The narrator is not a well-known public figure, but is well-known
in diplomatic circles. A sort of "behind-the-scenes" sort of
guy, so to speak, without high-ranking diplomatic status.
My initial impetus is to index people, activities, and events as
main headings, but mostly leaving out any of these asides in
relation to the narrator, as the user probably is going to be
more interested in the principals' actions and reactions in
regard to events and people. But I also think that a heading for
the narrator is necessary, like
Narrator
on British Foreign Office, 346
and interpretation of INF discussions, 10, 20-25, 150
and opinion of "new thinking", 12, 36, 75
on Yeltsin, 347, 354, 375
where the narrator's personal opinions and interpretations of
events add something to the reader's information pool. The
narrator's presence at an event thus would not be noted unless
there was some sort of value-added, eye-witness observation (the
narrator, by merit of the use of the personal "I" is naturally
present at nearly all events mentioned in the book.)
Likewise, should there be under Yeltsin, etc., an entry for the
narrator's opinion, such as
Yeltsin
narrator on, 347, 354, 375
rejection of Union treaty by, 346
etc.?
Any suggestions, insights, alternatives, etc. would be welcome.
************
Cynthia D. Bertelsen
INDEXER
Blacksburg, VA
cbertel@nrv.net
http://www.vt.edu:10021/B/bertel/ndx.html
=================================================================
======== Date: Sun, 13 Oct 1996 11:52:53 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
MaryMort@AOL.COM
Subject: Re: Question on biographical-historical type index
Hi, Cynthia,
It seems to me that there's a chance that your Narrator entry
will be very, very long and in fact cover the whole book. I
think that if a reader wants to know what the narrator thinks of
the INF discussions, he/she would look first under INF (or
nuclear weapons, or arms control...) My tendency would be only
to include personal information under the narrator's name, such
as education or career or family, and not views. Thus,
Narrator
marriage
at Oxford
as undersecretary of whatever
If these things are mentioned, of course!
My 2 cents...
Mary
--
* Mary Mortensen *
marymort@aol.com * Lawrence, Kansas
* USA
=================================================================
======== Date: Sun, 13 Oct 1996 16:10:15 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
"Cynthia D. Bertelsen" <cbertel@NRV.NET> Subject: Re:
Question on biographical-historical type index
Mary,
Thank you for your quick response.
Yes, I know that the entry would get to be too big, but because
the narrator is a former Soviet interpreter, his observations are
really quite startling sometimes in view of his past and his
associations. The reader will find those opinions, for example,
through a look at a heading as simple as "Brezhnev, Leonid,"
(because he expounds on Brezhnev in a manner that would have had
the narrator shot under other circumstances). I was rather hoping
that there might be some other way to get this added aspect of
the book into the index, but it seems that the only way** in this
case is to just put in the people, activities, and events, like I
said in my earlier post, and let the author speak for himself.
There are a number of other people in the book for whom there are
quite a few subheadings, too.
Sometimes, I guess, certain aspects about a book are not (alas)
to be the domain of the indexer, but rather of the book reviewer.
**I am constrained by the fact that I cannot break down the main
heading past one subhead; otherwise I would probably do what
Hazel K. Bell did in the index to Richard Burton (by Melvyn
Bragg), where she (in a 3-column mixed indented and run-in style
index) has 2 pages of entries in fine print on Burton, broken up
by major topics, like career, relationships, marriages, etc.,
that also include his viewpoint on a number of subjects.
At 11:52 AM 10/13/96 -0400, MaryMort@AOL.COM wrote:
>Hi, Cynthia,
>It seems to me that there's a chance that your Narrator entry
will be very,
>very long and in fact cover the whole book. I think that if a
reader wants
>to know what the narrator thinks of the INF discussions, he/she
would look
>first under INF (or nuclear weapons, or arms control...) My
tendency would
>be only to include personal information under the narrator's
name, such as
>education or career or family, and not views. Thus,
>
>Narrator
> marriage
> at Oxford
> as undersecretary of whatever
>
>If these things are mentioned, of course!
>
>My 2 cents...
>Mary
>--
>* Mary Mortensen *
marymort@aol.com
>* Lawrence, Kansas
>* USA
>
>
************
Cynthia D. Bertelsen
INDEXER
Blacksburg, VA
cbertel@nrv.net
http://www.vt.edu:10021/B/bertel/ndx.html
=================================================================
======== Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 06:21:01 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
DP1301@AOL.COM
Subject: Re: learning to index
I am one who did take the USDA course. I actually did my first
index 20 years ago for a library school professor. It was a
shoebox operation and I only helped on it - I was not the final
arbiter for it. I only worked as a librarian for six or seven
years, before I went onto other things. I seemed, however, to
approach any other task with a sense of "what order is this list
in?" with it's subset: "what's missing from this list?" and I
suppose the further corollary: "what are the rules for displaying
this list?"
Most of this non-library work had been in development
(fundraising) offices.
I'd been away from the library field for long enough that I took
the USDA course to remind me where the commas go. By that I mean,
I wanted a to know what the rules were again for order,
inclusivity and display - or if there are any such rules. The
blessing of it, among other things, was that it came with a
starter set of critical reference tools - Chicago, Mulvany,
Webster - although Webster I just about never use now. A
by-product of the USDA course was that my first tutor (I had
two), has become a friend and colleague - she sends me her
overflow from time to time.
I would never have made it as a shoebox indexer. I have
sufficient learning disability to regularly scramble alpha order.
Thank goodness for tools such as Cindex (my choice) and Macrex!
After the USDA course, joining ASI was also important - to read
and hear how other indexers solve those hard parts that crop up.
There are many solutions, just as this is another perspective for
getting on board with indexing.
Deborah
Deborah Patton
Baltimore, MD
410/243-4688
dp1301@aol.com
=================================================================
======== Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 08:50:48 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
WMacallen@AOL.COM
Subject: Re: AMWA Conference in Chicago
Has or does anyone on this listserve go to the American Medical
Writers' Conference (it's in Chicago next month?)
If so, can you let me know by email whether you think it is a
good investment in terms of time and money? I have feedback from
Ann Blum (Hello Ann), but wondered if anyone else has thoughts
about the Conference.
I'd like to attend, but it's happening the same week that I lead
a hiking weekend for the Appalachian Mountain Club in New
Hampshire so am trying to determine whether it's a good
investment of money and energy just before I lead a weekend.
Thanks for any info in advance.
Willa MacAllen
WMacallen@aol.com
=================================================================
======== Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 13:51:45 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
GLASSMANDL@AOL.COM
Subject: Author indexes are free
I'm out there trying to drum up that first indexing job and
received this (not uncommon and very discouraging) reply today:
"We nearly always talk the authors into doing their own indexing
on the theory that (a) they know more about the subject matter
than anyone else and (b) it's free."
It's easy for the publishers to convince themselves that (a) is
true, if they have (b) as an inducement.
Am I just contacting the wrong publishers?
Does anyone have a feel for back-of-the-book index percentages:
Author written vs in-house vs freelance created?
I just had to send off this cathartic post before diving back
into my list of "cold-calls".
Don Glassman
=================================================================
======== Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 14:27:50 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
David G Anderson <anderson@GLEN-NET.CA> Subject: Question on
biographical-historical type index
Cynthia D. Bertelson raises the important question of the place
of a first person narrator or actor in the index of a
biographical or historical work.
Her sample entry is:
>Narrator
> on British Foreign Office, 346
> and interpretation of INF discussions, 10, 20-25, 150
> and opinion of "new thinking", 12, 36, 75
> on Yeltsin, 347, 354, 375
My first observation is that all inoperative words should be
suppressed, viz., the leading "and" in the second and third
entries. I would also take it as given that the proper name of
the narrator would be employed.
Nowhere in the literature of the English-speaking peoples is the
relation of the narrator to his subject better presented than in
Boswell's _Life of Johnson_. The 1807 edition allows "Boswell
(the authour of this work)" but sixteen entry lines indexing all
four volumes, the first of which are:
introduced to Johnson, i.371, 374, 375
his "Account of Corsica," ii.48, 58, 59, 69
elected of the Literary Club, ii.245
his "Letter to the People of Scotland," iv.186
The 1904 Oxford edition distinguishes Boswell's "chief events and
works" from his "letters to" and "letters from" Dr. Johnson. Here
is the first of the 1904 index:
1760, first visit to London, i.256-7
1762, second visit to London, i.256-7
1763, gets to know Johnson, i.261; goes to study at
Utrecht, i.315
1765, visits Corsica, i.334
Here the order of entries is strictly chronological, befitting
the nature of the work itself. However
However, the evolving index in Boswell's case is a reflection of
the reading public's evolving level of interest in Boswell
himself. While he is still alive and is in the subordinate role
of the recorder and narrator, it is prpoer to enter only those
cases where he intrudes in the text of the work in a manner that
places him as an actor in the events he describes. Miss
Bertelson's example is indeed indexable:
>"When I contacted 10 Downing Street, I was told that the
>prime minister was out of his office and that they did not
>know when they could talk to him. I suspected that Major's
>office was reluctant to commit their boss to a telephone
>conversation of some sticky issue..., etc."
for here the author was an actor in the events. I would give him
all that is due to the living Boswell but would reserve the
richer indexing for some time in the future when, and if, the
narrator himself becomes an object of the general reader's
interest.
__________________________________
David G Anderson <anderson@glen-net.ca>
Williamstown, Ontario, Canada
__________________________________
=================================================================
======== Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 14:41:00 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Wildefire@AOL.COM
Subject: Re: Author indexes are free
In a message dated 96-10-14 14:00:02 EDT, Don wrote:
>
> I'm out there trying to drum up that first indexing job and
received this
> (not uncommon and very discouraging) reply today:
>
> "We nearly always talk the authors into doing their own
indexing on the
> theory that (a) they know more about the subject matter than
anyone else
> and (b) it's free."
>
> It's easy for the publishers to convince themselves that (a)
is true, if
> they
> have (b) as an inducement.
Hi Don,
ASI had a wonderful pamphlet a few years ago that pointed out to
publishers the advantages of having a professional indexer vs.
authors doing their indexing. Last I heard (about a year ago),
the pamphlet was being rewritten, but you may want to check into
that. Of course, having said that, it doesn't help you right now
and you may not have enough energy to educate publishers when
you're going through the angst of cold-calling. (However, you'll
find some good "come-backs" in the pamphlet for whenever you hear
that in the future.)
>
> Am I just contacting the wrong publishers?
Hang in there and keep trying! There *are* publishers who use
freelance indexers. It's just a matter of playing the Law of
Averages until you hit on those who do. (Then, you have to keep
playing the Law until you find some who will hire *you*. ;-D)
Also, don't interpret the term "publisher" too narrowly. If your
tastes in indexing run toward the technical side, there are
computer software and other companies who produce product manuals
requiring indexes. In fact, you can even broaden your scope to
other types of companies, for you won't believe how many
companies create huge amounts of documentation, if only for
inhouse use, requiring indexes. My very first potential indexing
job was to be with the mortgage department of a bank that had a
large amount of documentation needing indexing for their loan
counselors. Unfortunately, the bank reorganized and the project
went up in smoke. But you get the idea.
I'm just brainstorming here... but if your background is in
chemistry, for example, you may want to consider contacting
chemical manufacturers or pharmaceutical companies. If it's
electrical/electronic engineering, perhaps you can get jobs from
manufacturers in that field. I indexed 27 manuals for a
telecommunications equipment company on a mega-system they sell.
So, you see that this is a potentially fertile avenue to explore.
Another inducement toward exploring these types of "publishers"
is that they tend to pay more than traditional book publishers.
Other nontraditional publishers include technical documentation
firms (which is how I worked on the 27-manual project under the
auspices of another indexer who had them as a client) including
freelance technical writers, engineering societies (who don't
necessarily pay more than traditional publishers), etc. Have I
gotten the juices flowing? ;-D
Of course, you may run into "our writers do our indexes" there as
well, but at least this can stack the Law of Averages in your
favor more. The reference section of your local library is chock
full of directories of large companies organized according to
their type of business (SIC codes) so you can target companies in
fields that interest you. However, they tend to list only the
names of their corporate officers, not who's in charge of their
documentation. But it's a start! (They do give phone numbers and
addresses.)
Good luck!!!
Lynn Moncrief
TECHindex & Docs
Technical and Scientific Indexing
> Does anyone have a feel for back-of-the-book index
percentages: Author
> written vs in-house vs freelance created?
>
> I just had to send off this cathartic post before diving back
into my list
> of
> "cold-calls".
>
=================================================================
======== Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 14:52:43 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
"Cynthia D. Bertelsen" <cbertel@NRV.NET> Subject: Re: Author
indexes are free
Certainly with university presses (which I am most familiar
with), you will find a large number of author-generated indexes.
In fact, one editor recently told me that one of his authors took
the books' text files on disk, put in the page numbers to
correspond to the final proofs, and then generated his own index
in WORD 6.0 with WORD's indexing feature; the editor said that
that posed a threat to freelancers, which it does. I took a
moment to write back to the editor and pointed out that in my
opinion an author creates often creates indexes that lack the
structure and access points that a professional can insert. I
pointed out also that an indexer's ability to use
cross-references adds a great deal to an index. In most
author-generated indexes that I have seen, there are very few
cross-references. =20
My humble opinion is that we indexers as a group must try to make
the value of our product clearer to the authors (and in some
cases, to the editors).
How we do that, well, I am not quite sure. Maybe some newspaper
articles in local papers where there are lots of university
professors who are= publishing?
In terms of getting work, you just have to keep plugging away and
send out tons of resum=E9s every few months. I often send to the
same publishers= over
and over, because I really want to work for them. In some cases,
I have gotten work from those to whom I have sent my materials
more than once.
Sometimes cold calls work, as there may be something that has
come up (the author gets sick, his mother gets sick, he decides
he needs an index at the last minute, etc.).
Good luck.
At 01:51 PM 10/14/96 -0400, GLASSMANDL@AOL.COM wrote:
>I'm out there trying to drum up that first indexing job and
received this
>(not uncommon and very discouraging) reply today:
>
>"We nearly always talk the authors into doing their own indexing
on the
>theory that (a) they know more about the subject matter than
anyone else
>and (b) it's free."
>
>It's easy for the publishers to convince themselves that (a) is
true, if= they
>have (b) as an inducement.
>
>Am I just contacting the wrong publishers?
>Does anyone have a feel for back-of-the-book index percentages:
Author
>written vs in-house vs freelance created?
>
>I just had to send off this cathartic post before diving back
into my list= of
>"cold-calls".
>
>Don Glassman
>
>
************
Cynthia D. Bertelsen
INDEXER
Blacksburg, VA
cbertel@nrv.net
http://www.vt.edu:10021/B/bertel/ndx.html
=================================================================
======== Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 14:55:41 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Daveream@AOL.COM
Subject: Writer's Market CD
There's was mention in the local paper today that the 1997
edition of the Writer's Market publication will be available in
book, CD, or combined offerings.
I think it was $40 for the CD and $50 for both.
FYI, Dave
"Talking about music is like dancing about architecture."
=================================================================
======== Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 16:47:56 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
JPerlman@AOL.COM
Subject: Re: Author indexes are free
Don,
You're doing fine. That's par for the course. And no, you're
not contacting the wrong publishers. Follow Lynn's advice.
You've hit the "no's", which means you're primed, by the law of
averages, to hit a "yes" soon.
I have to tell you -- I used to be put off by that answer, and
now I don't give in to it that easily. Guess I'm getting feisty!
Recently, I was referred to a publisher who would have been a new
client. An author whose book I had indexed referred me to a
friend, who works in the same field, and whose publisher didn't
know an indexer who worked in the field. I got excited at the
prospect of a new client. I talked to the publisher, sent the
editor my resume, etc, and waited. I called back about 10 days
later, because I hadn't heard, and was told that she convinced
the author to do the index himself. My answer to her was "I'm
sorry to hear that." There was dead silence, as she was
obviously taken aback, and then she asked why I said that.
.... Lead in to my spiel. I told her that an expert, trained as
an indexer, would do a much better job than the author, that
indexing required a lot of skill, and that the author would
flounder and turn in "something", but it would have little
resemblance to what a professional indexer would do, and that the
publishing house would have to stand behind that index....
wouldn't it be better to have an index professionally done than
crudely done by an author who didn't know how and would rather be
doing something else....after all, this is the era of information
retrieval, and the index is an important tool. etc. etc.
Of course, she had no answer, and I said again that I thought it
would be better for all concerned to stick to professional
indexers, and to call on me if and when they need me. Haven't
heard back yet, but who knows?
This is also my approach when a publisher tells me that they have
the computer turn out an index, which undoubtedly is even worse
than one prepared by an untutored author, and, Don, you will also
hear this as a reason not to use freelance indexers. I gasp when
I hear that, and tell the "client" (non-client!) that nothing
takes the place of the human mind in doing the intellectual
analysis needed to create a good index.
Well, now I've given away my secrets! Hope this helps, Don, and
all you new indexers out there. Keep plugging. Many publishers
*do* hire freelancers, and many of us make a living at it, so it
can work for you. There are a lot of publishers out there! Keep
trying.
Janet Perlman
Southwest Indexing
=================================================================
======== Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 17:11:55 -0500 Reply-To:
becohen@prairienet.org
Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET>
From: "Barbara E. Cohen" <becohen@PRAIRIENET.ORG>
Subject: Re: Political Correctness
The reason I posted my example under the PC discussion is because
the book is all about political players and the author's opinion
of same (few of which opinions belonged in the index, in my
opinion).
Cynthia's book sounds very similar to mine--lots of little asides
and comments without always saying who or what was really going
on.
Cynthia: if you want to talk about how I solved some of my
problems with the book I just finished, feel free to call and we
can talk!
I too had trouble balancing the personal and political/historical
elements of the books I just indexed.
Barbara
--
Barbara E. Cohen
Indexing & Editorial Services
Champaign, IL
=================================================================
======== Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 23:27:44 -0400 Reply-To:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> Sender:
Indexer's Discussion Group <INDEX-L@BINGVMB.BITNET> From:
Helen Schinske <HSchinske@AOL.COM> Subject: pricing
In all the discussion of price-per-page, per-entry, etc. that
went on a while back, it occurred to me to wonder: since there is
no standard of how many words go on a page, what about pricing
per hundred or thousand words? It seems to me that a word count
should not be hard to come up with. At the least one could get
an estimate by counting the words in one chapter and comparing
that to the number of pages. I also considered that one might
charge by the size of the file, but Jan Wright pointed out to me
that different word processors create different-sized files, let
alone what happens when you get a document into Pagemaker or
Framemaker.
Sorry if this has come up before -- I may have spaced it.
Helen Schinske
HSchinske@aol.com